spot on Ken, my mate got a bitch pup, it was from a breeder in London , there going for £ 16-1800 quid . very loyal dogs his bitch is 12 months old 110lb like a feckin tank, the dogs can go up 14st . there are like in my mind big bullmastiffs , and like all big heavy breeds rotties,bullmastiffs , etc they (all) suffer with HD and other limb/joint probs , it was one of the reasons back in the 80s when I had bullmastiffs , that I came out of the breed , was fed up of being down the vets with one thing or other , and a nother thing a lot of the big breeds are not long lived 8-9 yea