cheers all for input, all comments regarded...
i wouldn't even dream of using the collar on full whack, i feel like i know my dog inside out, he's my best friend. I have never kicked or beat him to intentionally harm him 'teaching a lesson' not my style in the slightest
I reckon i am more than capable of using such devices in a controlled and necessary manner. My main issue is live stock or more specific sheep. No bother at all with cows, horse and don't blame him. I have used long string and lead behind ears but still wouldn't trust off the lead. Although he is very steady, if he were