Should Staffs Be Banned ?

[gnasher16 31,506]

 

 

Not entirely sure which point your trying to press home , that all dogs who attack are mental one or social is an instinct which can be lost , ?

but this is the point which people can't grasp , it's the point that a dog is social by nature not instinct , a pup is born social , if social was an instinct , why do people believe they need to train a dog to be social , instincts are not trainable for dogs , instincts by their very nature are a reflex, what folk need to do is promote social which is the very base , instincts occur when social breaks down

 

there is not animal that can achieve social like a dog , none , even higher developed mammals , dogs can be rolled over and belly rubbed , even dogs unfarmilar to us , try it with a f****n chimp and he'll rip your arm off at the elbow because he's all instinct,

If you want to see the difference between social by nature versus instinct , belly rub a cat , social breaks down very quickly there , a dog can manage it because it goes by feel , if it feels right it will go with it , it's what social by nature looks like

 

The point im making is that people talk about this whole " pack instinct " thing as if its some kind of guide to how we train a dog when in reality most dogs lost that instinct years ago.....most dogs do not even retain the instinct they were bred for in what is a blink of an eye time wise so why would they still have any kind of pack instinct......obviously a chimp is not a domesticated animal so theres no reason for its instincts to have been lost or diluted down but keep those chimps in a zoo with close human contact over enough generations and do you think they are going to retain those wild instincts very long.......a working breed of dog bred away from work cannot be expected to have a laid back easy going social reliable disposition its like expecting a bird to only fly when you tell it to i dont think its any coincidence that the attacks we have seen with pit bulls for example have mostly been committed by non fighting dogs and i wouldnt mind betting we see more and more attacks the less pit bulls are used for their intended purpose.

 

Im not saying dogs are not very sociable animals of course they are but supressed instinct is a dangerous game to play in dogs bred for aggression in my opinion and its something we encourage with certain breeds of dog.

Edited October 17, 2016 by gnasher16

[king 12,030]

What about domestic dogs in certain countrys who roam as a pack.

Theres a pecking order established in them packs.and they are domestic dogs.who has the best scraps from bins.etc.

I dont think dogs have lost that pack instinct years ago.

They seem to revert straight back to pack animals after being domesticated for 100s of years.

[ryaldinhio 5,187]

Should staffs be banned? No.

 

Should all dogs be on lisence? IMO yes.

 

People take dogs on for the wrong reasons not knowing what they are bred for,can do or need.

[gnasher16 31,506]

What about domestic dogs in certain countrys who roam as a pack.

Theres a pecking order established in them packs.and they are domestic dogs.who has the best scraps from bins.etc.

I dont think dogs have lost that pack instinct years ago.

They seem to revert straight back to pack animals after being domesticated for 100s of years.

So the only way to retain pack instinct is to let them run wild...........a dog is either a domestic pet or its not....just because one dog dominates another doesnt mean he,s taking his place within " the pack "

 

I just think that expecting certain traits and instincts to remain intact over centuries when they are not being practised is unrealistic we see dogs in everyday life that beyond their basic dna structure are physically and mentally barely even dogs......to think they have still held onto their earliest most basic instincts.....no i dont buy it.

Edited October 17, 2016 by gnasher16

[bigmac 97kt 13,832]

Had my first one 11yrs and the second one 13yrs

 

had no issues with them both loved the kids and grandkids to bits

 

they could do any thing to them and they would just lay there and roll over lol

 

was at the park one day and this lad came in with his doberman and rock wiler standing there with his bomber jacket and his doc martin boots and smirking he let them off and they came running for one of my staffs but my mate who i was talking to little terrier went running to them yapping as they do they both turned tail and ran back to there owner you should of seen his face lol

 

Its not just staffs other breeds can be just as dangerous

 

its the way there brought up

 

my two were loved and all ways around kids from an early age

 

but even loved and well brought up dogs of any breed can turn for what ever reason

 

broke my heart when i got them both pts as the big c got them both in there back end

 

thats it for me and the wife no more for us of any breed

 

here is a pic of the last one .

 

My heart go,s out to the mother at the end of the day she has still lost a son

 

RIP YOUNG ONE RIP

 

ATVBMAC

 

 

 

[Jonjon79 13,358]

Had my first one 11yrs and the second one 13yrs

 

had no issues with them both loved the kids and grandkids to bits

 

they could do any thing to them and they would just lay there and roll over lol

 

was at the park one day and this lad came in with his doberman and rock wiler standing there with his bomber jacket and his doc martin boots and smirking he let them off and they came running for one of my staffs but my mate who i was talking to little terrier went running to them yapping as they do they both turned tail and ran back to there owner you should of seen his face lol

 

Its not just staffs other breeds can be just as dangerous

 

its the way there brought up

 

my two were loved and all ways around kids from an early age

 

but even loved and well brought up dogs of any breed can turn for what ever reason

 

broke my heart when i got them both pts as the big c got them both in there back end

 

thats it for me and the wife no more for us of any breed

 

here is a pic of the last one .

 

My heart go,s out to the mother at the end of the day she has still lost a son

 

RIP YOUNG ONE RIP

 

ATVBMAC

 

 

 

You can't fool us Mac - that's a badger

[scothunter 12,609]

Im actually suprised more people aren't killed or seriously injured. The amount of these type of dogs that are owned by the type who shouldnt and have no idea or even care to train them in even the basic of commands.

In fact the more out of control they are the prouder some owners are.

I see these dogs running about parks while there owners are sitting on swings and fences smoking joints and drinking.

 

They see another dog and automatically come charging towards it paying no heed to the shouting from there arsehole owners! Im actually shocked the amount of people with kids who dont tell them to take themselfs and there dogs to f**k out of a kids park.

[Lenmcharristar 10,296]

What about cats? They bite more people than dogs each year and not a word said, they get protected status and kill more wildlife each year than dogs, they shit all over people's gardens, but dogs get the bad rep, it's foolish owners that need looked at

[bird 10,014]

What about cats? They bite more people than dogs each year and not a word said, they get protected status and kill more wildlife each year than dogs, they shit all over people's gardens, but dogs get the bad rep, it's foolish owners that need looked at

bloody hell don't mention feckin cats, had one jump on be back and tried to bite me , was courting the wife at the time, and the cat was 1/2 wild bloody big tom cat didn't like men lol . some good threads on here regards staffs, as said i was round bull breeds as kid and staffs more so bitches are good pet dogs. but i still think there better type breeds out there that make good pets, i still think your average type lurcher are prob the best, my 2 are brill with people/kids, and good with dogs

[DogFox123 1,379]

Speaking of mixed breeds, I've just grabbed a Labradoodle at work that's escaped. The dog was huge, must have been a Giant Poodle cross, I didn't know they got that big.....

[forest of dean redneck 12,022]

What about cats? They bite more people than dogs each year and not a word said, they get protected status and kill more wildlife each year than dogs, they shit all over people's gardens, but dogs get the bad rep, it's foolish owners that need looked at

Don't talk to me about fecking cats, there's 3 of the b*****d things here,there cat shit in front garden ,then caught one shitting in veg trug out back it had actually climbed under the top part of indoor rodent cage to shit in bottom of the trug, then last night one which is half brain dead, neutured female came an in front of us sprayed up front my lizard viv.

I told her she takes it to vets because if I do it its on a one way trip! Bloody things need to go missing!

[THE STIFFMEISTER 17,145]

It's personally a huge annoyance of mine when I see people buying Stafford etc as a house dog, I know the story too well sadly, it arrives in the summer, the jags are done Facebook photos, stupid name, then after the weather breaks all walks are stopped, next summer killer or tyson or lady is tearing round the garden scratching the panel fence to bits at Mrs Gallaghers bicon frise three doors down clowns

 

Personally for me I truly believe a tax should be put on all mollasser types at birth, a registration fee, insurance chipped etc for all bull types, boxers bulldogs etc a grand to register a litter, if later on a dog is found inchipped or no tattoo or registration, then it's jagged. Gone. Rescue centres are full of f****d up bull types

 

Stick them all in the ground and start again

 

 

.

[Casso 1,261]

 

 

 

 

Not entirely sure which point your trying to press home , that all dogs who attack are mental one or social is an instinct which can be lost , ?

but this is the point which people can't grasp , it's the point that a dog is social by nature not instinct , a pup is born social , if social was an instinct , why do people believe they need to train a dog to be social , instincts are not trainable for dogs , instincts by their very nature are a reflex, what folk need to do is promote social which is the very base , instincts occur when social breaks down

 

there is not animal that can achieve social like a dog , none , even higher developed mammals , dogs can be rolled over and belly rubbed , even dogs unfarmilar to us , try it with a f****n chimp and he'll rip your arm off at the elbow because he's all instinct,

If you want to see the difference between social by nature versus instinct , belly rub a cat , social breaks down very quickly there , a dog can manage it because it goes by feel , if it feels right it will go with it , it's what social by nature looks like

 

The point im making is that people talk about this whole " pack instinct " thing as if its some kind of guide to how we train a dog when in reality most dogs lost that instinct years ago.....most dogs do not even retain the instinct they were bred for in what is a blink of an eye time wise so why would they still have any kind of pack instinct......obviously a chimp is not a domesticated animal so theres no reason for its instincts to have been lost or diluted down but keep those chimps in a zoo with close human contact over enough generations and do you think they are going to retain those wild instincts very long.......a working breed of dog bred away from work cannot be expected to have a laid back easy going social reliable disposition its like expecting a bird to only fly when you tell it to i dont think its any coincidence that the attacks we have seen with pit bulls for example have mostly been committed by non fighting dogs and i wouldnt mind betting we see more and more attacks the less pit bulls are used for their intended purpose.

 

Im not saying dogs are not very sociable animals of course they are but supressed instinct is a dangerous game to play in dogs bred for aggression in my opinion and its something we encourage with certain breeds of dog.

The fact that a dog is trainable at all is because it is a pack animal !!

 

On the other hand if your referring to dominance training as a way of instilling a social mindset you may be inching towards the truth

 

Every f***ing hardshaw with a attitude will have approached training a dog through a dominance mindset which is a huge part of the problem , a dog will fall into line itself , if 1 we commit to training correctly , and 2 it gets to express its tempment driven energetic output with us , every dog is imminently trainable

 

In fact give me a hard bitten over a medium driven dog any day because it's temperment is right there it's not hidden under lack of drive ,

 

There is no lack of social in today's dogs my friend , what there is in buckets is a lack of understanding

 

If we can get our head round this , the behavior is hard wired in the dog , we have bred it in over generations, once we know it's there we can channel it into appropriate behaviors but sitting and giving paws or any of that other shite is not going to fulfill a higher tempered dog when he's in a driven mindset but without the work for them people need to be proactive in reducing the charge building up until maturity where it pops

 

It's more a testament to how social the dog is that more don't trip out , when I see unfortunate cases like this the only thing I see is a dog finally pushed to the limits, child dies , dog dies but we comtinue on with the same because the gods honest truth is nobody understands it , when I hear the dog is mental banter all it does is excuse the behavior of owners and neglects the reality of dogs ,

Edited October 18, 2016 by Casso

[Casso 1,261]

Dogs by their very nature were bred to build up a charge,

 

From the time it was a pup the way to ground a feeling of excitement or stimulation was by mouthing and shaking, it's instinctive but it's also a phase for most dogs unlike working dogs who can be manipulated for our advantage to continue this circle of building up a charge in a working environment and grounding that charge out through work ,

 

it gives the dog the ability to contrast WHERE and WHAT to prey on and most of all the dog can tune you in because you become Alpha not because you dominate the dog but because you facilate he's every natural inclination, his pattern recognition pin points you as his avenue to flow

 

What we have in explosive dogs in these situations is an animal who also builds up a charge but in a very different environment never known what prey is or what it looks like It can't contrast , its local environment become its hunting zone and it's charge is built up by objects in its world , which as it stands are humans , dogs cats , bikes cars , you name it , the dog is hard wired to build and build a charge , the sight of a dog becomes like the sight of a fox to a hunting dog , imagine taking out a fox dog and walking him along the street with people leading foxes around in front of him , try doing that for years at a time and then stand back in dismay when the buildup tips the dog over into some volcanic energetic outburst into something closer to home

 

I used to wonder why two male terriers could be housed together for years on end as my uncle did and when tied up together at an earth would start whining then yapping and barking and finally when they recognised the sound of spade on stone tip over into all out war with each other , each had reached boiling point , it wasn't personal it was energy in that moment they each became a release for each other but they could contrast between the sights and sounds that created energy out and the calm and peaceful environment at home

 

And the higher tempered the dog is , the higher the resistance it can overcome, like a good cattle dog who just won't get the same buzz out of anything less they are attracted to a deeper vibration of prey animal ,sheep don't cut it the dog needs more resistance , its no wonder the herding breeds excel at man work , the more it can overcome the better the feeling, but all it's doing in the end is fulfilling that circle , that feeling it first had as a pup when stimulated grab it and shake like f**k

Edited October 19, 2016 by Casso

[bird 10,014]

Dogs by their very nature were bred to build up a charge,

 

From the time it was a pup the way to ground a feeling of excitement or stimulation was by mouthing and shaking, it's instinctive but it's also a phase for most dogs unlike working dogs who can be manipulated for our advantage to continue this circle of building up a charge in a working environment and grounding that charge out through work ,

 

it gives the dog the ability to contrast WHERE and WHAT to prey on and most of all the dog can tune you in because you become Alpha not because you dominate the dog but because you facilate he's every natural inclination, his pattern recognition pin points you as his avenue to flow

 

What we have in explosive dogs in these situations is an animal who also builds up a charge but in a very different environment never known what prey is or what it looks like It can't contrast , its local environment become its hunting zone and it's charge is built up by objects in its world , which as it stands are humans , dogs cats , bikes cars , you name it , the dog is hard wired to build and build a charge , the sight of a dog becomes like the sight of a fox to a hunting dog , imagine taking out a fox dog and walking him along the street with people leading foxes around in front of him , try doing that for years at a time and then stand back in dismay when the buildup tips the dog over into some volcanic energetic outburst into something closer to home

 

I used to wonder why two male terriers could be housed together for years on end as my uncle did and when tied up together at an earth would start whining then yapping and barking and finally when they recognised the sound of spade on stone tip over into all out war with each other , each had reached boiling point , it wasn't personal it was energy in that moment they each became a release for each other but they could contrast between the sights and sounds that created energy out and the calm and peaceful environment at home

 

And the higher tempered the dog is , the higher the resistance it can overcome, like a good cattle dog who just won't get the same buzz out of anything less they are attracted to a deeper vibration of prey animal ,sheep don't cut it the dog needs more resistance , its no wonder the herding breeds excel at man work , the more it can overcome the better the feeling, but all it's doing in the end is fulfilling that circle , that feeling it first had as a pup when stimulated grab it and shake like f**k

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