Arizona Cattle Dogs

[SheepChaser 8,082]

Then dogs have some bull somewhere  

[Campbell 6]

No, that;s me off Australian Cattle Dogs now.  I'll stick with my GSD.

[Aussie Whip 3,827]

Arizona cattle dogs?We only have a few breeds originating here and the Aussie cattle dog is one of them,a true Oz icon.There are the dogs they call Australian shepherds which are not Australian at all,it's a strange World.

[sandymere 8,261]

American cattle dog 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.(!64.56:886/dagleyranch/videos/501806787083504/&ved=2ahUKEwjPj6SBz8zqAhWITcAKHZSBClg4HhCjtAEwAXoECAgQAQ&usg=AOvVaw1TPqnxd9Yb-3zlQe0qQhML

 

[SheepChaser 8,082]

7 minutes ago, sandymere said:

American cattle dog 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.(!64.56:886/dagleyranch/videos/501806787083504/&ved=2ahUKEwjPj6SBz8zqAhWITcAKHZSBClg4HhCjtAEwAXoECAgQAQ&usg=AOvVaw1TPqnxd9Yb-3zlQe0qQhML

 

Most of them use border collies. But everyone likes to ‘invent’ a breed. Just like oz, the USA has a thing for just taking mongrel breeds and working them at a job. They then get rebranded. Pretty cool really, but they all get a Facebook page and web site. It’s just mirroring what we did a long time ago before we formalised breeds and what we used them for. 

[Neal 1,787]

4 hours ago, Aussie Whip said:

Arizona cattle dogs?We only have a few breeds originating here and the Aussie cattle dog is one of them,a true Oz icon.There are the dogs they call Australian shepherds which are not Australian at all,it's a strange World.

I might be misremembering this but I'm sure I read somewhere once that the "Australian shepherd" (i.e. the one that looks like a chunky bob-tailed merle collie) was bred in America using dogs from Iberia but called Australian because they thought it looked a bit Australian (maybe like the Australian Smithfield?). The only reason I remember that is because one won Crufts a few years back and people kept thinking my kelpies were the same breed because they had "Australian" in the title. 

[Aussie Whip 3,827]

1 minute ago, Neal said:

I might be misremembering this but I'm sure I read somewhere once that the "Australian shepherd" (i.e. the one that looks like a chunky bob-tailed merle collie) was bred in America using dogs from Iberia but called Australian because they thought it looked a bit Australian (maybe like the Australian Smithfield?). The only reason I remember that is because one won Crufts a few years back and people kept thinking my kelpies were the same breed because they had "Australian" in the title. 

That's interesting I didn't know much about why they named them.I hope you corrected them about the kelpies,I believe the Australian shepherds are next to useless at anything except flyball lol.

[Aussie Whip 3,827]

2 hours ago, SheepChaser said:

Most of them use border collies. But everyone likes to ‘invent’ a breed. Just like oz, the USA has a thing for just taking mongrel breeds and working them at a job. They then get rebranded. Pretty cool really, but they all get a Facebook page and web site. It’s just mirroring what we did a long time ago before we formalised breeds and what we used them for. 

Our working breeds,cattle dogs,kelpies,roo dogs have been around a long time before Facebook lol, as were the men who fine tuned and worked them for the harsh conditions here.You have to bring in other breeds to suit the climate, terrain,or game hunted.

[scutty96 313]

21 hours ago, MH1 said:

Anyone know much about these? Are they just an ACD with a stumpy tail?

https://trueblueworkingstumpys.home.blog/photos/

[SheepChaser 8,082]

16 minutes ago, Aussie Whip said:

Our working breeds,cattle dogs,kelpies,roo dogs have been around a long time before Facebook lol, as were the men who fine tuned and worked them for the harsh conditions here.You have to bring in other breeds to suit the climate, terrain,or game hunted.

You missed my point. But thanks for that. 

[Black neck 15,162]

1 hour ago, SheepChaser said:

You missed my point. But thanks for that. 

You sure know how 2 put a man down sherif

[Shadow100 1,065]

Maybe I’m being daft but I’d think when discussing Australian cattle dogs the Australian man might be worth listening to, maybe 

[SheepChaser 8,082]

6 minutes ago, Shadow100 said:

Maybe I’m being daft but I’d think when discussing Australian cattle dogs the Australian man might be worth listening to, maybe 

Looks like you missed my point to. 
 

I wasn’t arguing with the man about Australian cattle dogs at all.

What I said was - most Americans use border collies to work cattle, rather than the above mentioned ‘American cattle dogs’. 
 

I then proceeded to say that in both the USA and America, they have a common theme of taking unusual breeds and mixing them together to produce fit for purpose working dogs - ie the Aussie cattle dog, the pig dogs, the American cattle dog etc. It’s not in many other countries you will see working dogs with Great Dane in for example....... often these lads then stabilise these mongrel breeds and give them a name I.e Bull Arab, Gruber hound, Kelpie, ACD etc also the NZ huntaway is a good example from another country with a similar theme. 
 

Its still going on now and in the world of face book etc it’s easier to establish a ‘known name’ as you can publicise and promote your breed - Gruber hounds being a good example (pig dog). 
 

What I said was - this is all very interesting as it’s exactly what we did in establishing most (all) of our recognises breeds, but what’s in them and how it was done has been lost in the mists of time. Being more modern creations - the formulation of most of these new world breeds Is more easily tracked.

 

But yer you saw the word Facebook and told me the breeds in Australia were created pre face book........... no shit Sherlock. And actually ...... not strictly true as they are being created currently. But thanks for making me explain myself  

[SheepChaser 8,082]

22 minutes ago, Shadow100 said:

Maybe I’m being daft but I’d think when discussing Australian cattle dogs the Australian man might be worth listening to, maybe 

Just for the record that’s also like saying that as a welsh man I know lots about corgis ........

Or all Americans have a deep knowledge of American bull dogs .......

But for the record ...... I didn’t say I knew more about ACD s than the Aussie ..... I said he, like you ...... had missed my point. 

 

[Black neck 15,162]

What the hell happened here