Charlie Gard

[Neobliviscaris1776 1,998]

 

 

Anyone who thinks that a stranger has the right to decide wether your own child should live or have the opportunity to receive care in some form is mentally ill.

 

What confidence does this give people in the NHS and the justice system?

 

Why anybody would go to a doctor or the NHS unless absolutely necessary is a mystery to me.

you should read up a bit on what they have been discussing in the courts before making statements like that, to keep using artificial means to keep the poor lad alive is the wrong move, even the yank doctor who came over after offering treatment agrees with the descision to switch off the machines, to think otherwise points to mental illness in other places

I never comment unless I've researched both sides of a topic and some people will come to a different opinion than yours.

[neil82 1,008]

 

 

Anyone who thinks that a stranger has the right to decide wether your own child should live or have the opportunity to receive care in some form is mentally ill.

 

What confidence does this give people in the NHS and the justice system?

 

Why anybody would go to a doctor or the NHS unless absolutely necessary is a mystery to me.

you should read up a bit on what they have been discussing in the courts before making statements like that, to keep using artificial means to keep the poor lad alive is the wrong move, even the yank doctor who came over after offering treatment agrees with the decision to switch off the machines, to think otherwise points to mental illness in other places

How can you say that keeping the child alive is the wrong move? It's incredible how people actually think that they have the right wether someone lives or not. Welcome to 1930s Germany

 

why don`t you actually look into this case before making such a judgement, whats incredible is how blind some people are to actual situations (and if you want to drag up 1930`s Germany, the child would not have survived for a week), I've put up a link to the court case transcript, try reading it

[Neobliviscaris1776 1,998]

Why do you assume I haven't looked into the case?

 

The situation is who decides? the panel or the parents.....as i said previously who decides whether a child continues to live or not?

 

That's the situation. Do some research other than the regurgitated rhetoric that's churned out.

 

It's about choice.

 

You take choice away......that's it, game over

[South hams hunter 8,837]

Why do you assume I haven't looked into the case?

 

The situation is who decides? the panel or the parents.....as i said previously who decides whether a child continues to live or not?

 

That's the situation. Do some research other than the regurgitated rhetoric that's churned out.

 

It's about choice.

 

You take choice away......that's it, game over

The parents are given a lot of choices, I know I've been there. But when they start thinking that keeping the kid Alice so they have a child is more important than stopping the ongoing pain the doctors have to make medical decisions.

 

To a degree in agree we should get choices but at the same time we aren't medical professionals so ultimately the doctors should be allowed to do what they have to do

[Neobliviscaris1776 1,998]

 

Why do you assume I haven't looked into the case?

 

The situation is who decides? the panel or the parents.....as i said previously who decides whether a child continues to live or not?

 

That's the situation. Do some research other than the regurgitated rhetoric that's churned out.

 

It's about choice.

 

You take choice away......that's it, game over

The parents are given a lot of choices, I know I've been there. But when they start thinking that keeping the kid Alice so they have a child is more important than stopping the ongoing pain the doctors have to make medical decisions.

 

To a degree in agree we should get choices but at the same time we aren't medical professionals so ultimately the doctors should be allowed to do what they have to do

People should always have choices wether they are medical professionals or not. Some people don't like making choices because most of the time people are misinformed or choose not to inform themselves.

 

The problem is where do you draw the line.

Do you take away life support from all the other people that rely on all types of medical machinery aswell as those who rely on drugs and medicine's to keep them alive artificially?

 

To look at the case and come to the conclusion that the Doctors in the UK have only the child's best interest at, is absurd. As Doctors it is their duty and service to provide whatever treatment may help a patient and to increase life expectancy, not to override the choices and decisions of the parents.

[scothunter 12,609]

The drs /courts didn't make this decision lightly and im sure they to shed a tear or two and wrestled with their consionce.

Faced with the facts and medical evidence stating it would just prolong tge childs suffering they came to a difficult decision. One which i would never want to make.

 

We have to listen to the Drs they are in better position and more clued up than you or I.

 

Even judges calling them scumbags is pretty unfair.They are there in cases like this to take difficult decisions impartially and as i said im sure they did so with heavy hearts.probaly more so than the lobbyists and trumps who jump on cases like this for there own f***ing agendas!They are the scumbags imo.

[Neobliviscaris1776 1,998]

The drs /courts didn't make this decision lightly and im sure they to shed a tear or two and wrestled with their consionce.

Faced with the facts and medical evidence stating it would just prolong tge childs suffering they came to a difficult decision. One which i would never want to make.

 

We have to listen to the Drs they are in better position and more clued up than you or I.

 

Even judges calling them scumbags is pretty unfair.They are there in cases like this to take difficult decisions impartially and as i said im sure they did so with heavy hearts.probaly more so than the lobbyists and trumps who jump on cases like this for there own f***ing agendas!They are the scumbags imo.

I agree it's a difficult situation as all medical ones are.

 

You mentioned that you wouldn't want to make such a decision... that's really the point of this whole debate. You don't have to worry about it, because it's not your right to make such a decision. Why?

 

Because it's not your or my decision to make. And not a doctor's decision to make either.

 

"We have to listen to the Drs they are in better position and more clued up than you or I."

 

I agree, but what has their advice got to do with the actual decision being made? Where does the parents choice or rights come into play?

[scothunter 12,609]

Im sure they were consulted in all aspects of the kids well being. At end of the day it came down to the actual suffering the kid was having to endure.

 

Obv the parents were biased hence the need for a judge.

 

Well thats how i interperate it anyway, but thats just my humble opinion for what its worth.

[pesky1972 4,931]

To look at the case and come to the conclusion that the Doctors in the UK have only the child's best interest at, is absurd. As Doctors it is their duty and service to provide whatever treatment may help a patient and to increase life expectancy, not to override the choices and decisions of the parents.

This is utter pish imo. Modern medicine could keep thousands of people 'alive' on life support every year.., so why don't they? The family are told the score, and the plug gets pulled. That's just how it has to be, otherwise the hospitals would be full of brain dead people and bereft families hoping for miracles that'll never arrive.

 

I wonder if all the tweeters, forum posters and internet wonders that seem to know so much more than the team of expert doctors do about the boy and his condition, have ever considered that he might have suffered MORE because of all the public attention and the pressure it's put on the NHS & courts?

[dave88 1,565]

I spoke to a woman at the kids park the other day about this...she was given 24 hours by Great Ormond Street to say goodbye to her one month old son before they turned his life support off...he had heart problems and there was nothing else they could do.

She has the utmost respect for the hospital and fund raises for them all year round (apparently they need £90 million a year on top of what the nhs gives them just to function)...she understands that the hospital didnt make the decision lightly and did exhaust every option and agrees that switching Charlies machine off is the right thing to do.

I can't imagine having my parental rights taken from me and being told that someone else gets to make a decision like that but i DO understand why it has to be done...a case of 'a shit job but someones got to do it'

Edited July 27, 2017 by daveee88

[Neobliviscaris1776 1,998]

 

To look at the case and come to the conclusion that the Doctors in the UK have only the child's best interest at, is absurd. As Doctors it is their duty and service to provide whatever treatment may help a patient and to increase life expectancy, not to override the choices and decisions of the parents.

This is utter pish imo. Modern medicine could keep thousands of people 'alive' on life support every year.., so why don't they? The family are told the score, and the plug gets pulled. That's just how it has to be, otherwise the hospitals would be full of brain dead people and bereft families hoping for miracles that'll never arrive.

 

I wonder if all the tweeters, forum posters and internet wonders that seem to know so much more than the team of expert doctors do about the boy and his condition, have ever considered that he might have suffered MORE because of all the public attention and the pressure it's put on the NHS & courts?

Modern medicine could keep thousands of people 'alive' on life support every year.....

 

Yes it does, what's your point?

 

It's incredible that to disagree with some on a case like this, automatically means that you just know enough about it.

 

I'd say most people don't know enough about most things, and that's the problem.

 

We're all happy to accept the doctors and judges right to make a decision but not the parents if they chose to continue.

 

Unbelievable hypocrisy which threatens all human rights and future case's of a similar standing.

[pesky1972 4,931]

We're all happy to accept the doctors and judges right to make a decision but not the parents if they chose to continue.

 

Unbelievable hypocrisy which threatens all human rights and future case's of a similar standing.

The difference is the doctors know he has no chance but the parents couldn't accept it.

As an observer, (and not that it makes me happy) I'd go with the doctor's opinion every time as (like I posted earlier in the thread) they are the medical professionals with the years of training and experience and who's decisions are emotionally detached from the patient.

[Neobliviscaris1776 1,998]

 

We're all happy to accept the doctors and judges right to make a decision but not the parents if they chose to continue.

 

Unbelievable hypocrisy which threatens all human rights and future case's of a similar standing.

The difference is the doctors know he has no chance but the parents couldn't accept it.

As an observer, (and not that it makes me happy) I'd go with the doctor's opinion every time as (like I posted earlier in the thread) they are the medical professionals with the years of training and experience and who's decisions are emotionally detached from the patient.

He has no chance? Apart from the Dr in the USA who's 14 patients that received treatment have lived longer?

 

If you choose to always let others decide for you, what are you actually deciding.

 

Letting others make your decisions is giving up your rights and that's very sad indeed that some people feel so strongly the desire to do that.

[dave88 1,565]

The doctor from the US himself has said it more than likely wouldn't help him

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/news.sky.com/story/amp/us-doctor-dr-michio-hirano-speaks-out-in-charlie-gard-case-10962056

[Neobliviscaris1776 1,998]

The doctor from the US himself has said it more than likely wouldn't help him

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/news.sky.com/story/amp/us-doctor-dr-michio-hirano-speaks-out-in-charlie-gard-case-10962056

So... there is a chance that it may work. It's incredible the lack of respect for life there is in society today and how people almost hate the rights they have to choose. Well continuing as things are going and you will have no right to choose. But I suppose many will be relieved when it happens.