Lachhiman Gurung ( gurkha soldier )

[JDHUNTING 1,817]

The consistency is that our society has evolved quicker than our brains, it's not natural to go to war when there is no benefit to the men fighting it what was the point of all our troops dieing in world war one? Do we have more territory than we did at the start of it for the fighters to settle into and reproduce? No we just handed it all back while the guys at the top of the pyramid carved up the (un-natural) profit or power over a different tribe. Then we just let them rebuild and did it all again just one generation on and we would of done it again one generation on if not for nukes. 

[Greb147 6,808]

Just now, JDHUNTING said:

The consistency is that our society has evolved quicker than our brains, it's not natural to go to war when there is no benefit to the men fighting it what was the point of all our troops dieing in world war one? Do we have more territory than we did at the start of it for the fighters to settle into and reproduce? No we just handed it all back while the guys at the top of the pyramid carved up the (un-natural) profit or power over a different tribe. Then we just let them rebuild and did it all again just one generation on and we would of done it again one generation on if not for nukes. 

And you think all over wars before greatly benefited the fighting man? 

[JDHUNTING 1,817]

11 minutes ago, Greb147 said:

Everything that is happening or that has happened is completely natural. 

You was stating yesterday that colonialism had a negative effect on the working classes and complained that your grandfather died for nothing in WW1. 

Where is the consistency? 

I don't think what we are doing is natural in the sense of its always natural to further your genes, it is natural we are animals so absolutely anything we do is natural in one way or another.

Male lions roam around to find territory, when found they kill or drive off any other males and kill every other lion they can't mate with. If lions started having a conscience and stopped killing each other then their numbers would explode beyond what their territory can support and the balance in that area would be gone. I don't see us any different. 

[gnasher16 29,754]

15 minutes ago, Greb147 said:

Everything that is happening or that has happened is completely natural. 

 

What could possibly be more unnatural than forcing totally opposing races to live together !!

Many different people from many different races find it difficult to live in harmony,yet having imported and inherited the problems of third world countries....allegedly WE are the problem for not liking it ..........you couldnt make it up !

[JDHUNTING 1,817]

4 minutes ago, Greb147 said:

And you think all over wars before greatly benefited the fighting man? 

Yes of course all wars that took place before the concept of currency would have been fought for nothing other than territory and mating rights, if your in a family group with I don't know 3 square miles of territory and your groups grown to a size were you can't feed any more mouths from said territory how can taking over next doors patch not be a benefit?

[Astanley 11,498]

I'm not referring to skin colour ,but if you force different ethnicities ,different cultures ,different religions together and expect it to become one big happy melting pot then we have learned nothing from history .Yugoslavia and the Baltic States should of taught us that much .

[gnasher16 29,754]

34 minutes ago, JDHUNTING said:

I always believed war is an essential part of being human, maybe even our most important driving force, it's what has kept populations in check since the year dot, and drove the evolution of man and society. I think Europeans got so good at killing on such a huge scale it sickened us to it and we've simply become to soppy and "human" for our own good and halted the natural balance of the world and stopped us evolving it's not natural to have rules and morals re killing. The natural path would be for a stronger or more advanced population to go to war with a weaker one and kill them off and take over their lands in a constant cycle of war and fighting. I just don't think we are capable of being that natural anymore or even if it's possible given the destructive nature of our most advanced weapons. Look at chimps they have wars, they kill their neighbours at every opportunity and when there numbers get to large for their territory they invade another territory and kill all the other chimps in it. If you subscribe to the idea we are animals then we would be no different. No one in their right mind would accuse an animal of being cruel they just do what their instincts dictate why should humans be any different.

Thats one way of looking at it....personally i think its a lot more simple than that im not sure theres a word for it but we seem to have gone all guilty about evolving as a race,put the brakes on to let the blacks catch up.....so much so that instead of just playing dumb and hope they catch up at some point we,re now actively encouraging the dilution of our race in the hope that if whites go 2 steps back and blacks jump 2 steps forward we can meet in the middle and live happily ever after......a little bit like adding Pekingese blood to a line of Lurchers..........a total man made reversal of natural selection and evolution.

[Greb147 6,808]

42 minutes ago, JDHUNTING said:

I don't think what we are doing is natural in the sense of its always natural to further your genes, it is natural we are animals so absolutely anything we do is natural in one way or another.

Male lions roam around to find territory, when found they kill or drive off any other males and kill every other lion they can't mate with. If lions started having a conscience and stopped killing each other then their numbers would explode beyond what their territory can support and the balance in that area would be gone. I don't see us any different. 

The difference is we do have a conscience and on the whole no right from wrong. 

[Greb147 6,808]

25 minutes ago, Astanley said:

I'm not referring to skin colour ,but if you force different ethnicities ,different cultures ,different religions together and expect it to become one big happy melting pot then we have learned nothing from history .Yugoslavia and the Baltic States should of taught us that much .

The USA puts a big spanner in the works to that theory. 

[Born Hunter 17,646]

4 minutes ago, Greb147 said:

The USA puts a big spanner in the works to that theory. 

So US history isn't littered with ethnic/racial tension? The country literally imploded in civil war because they couldn't agree on how to treat blacks! LOL

The only thing holding the place together is the constitution and the american dream. It's a nation founded on a common ideal, rather than a common ethnic identity.

[Greb147 6,808]

7 minutes ago, Born Hunter said:

So US history isn't littered with ethnic/racial tension? The country literally imploded in civil war because they couldn't agree on how to treat blacks! LOL

The only thing holding the place together is the constitution and the american dream. It's a nation founded on a common ideal, rather than a common ethnic identity.

Great, so you have to delve back 150 years to the time of the civil war as evidence it doesn't work. 

We are living in the most peaceful times in history, racial tension is better than all out war. 

That just shows how everyone can buy in to a myth, its been doing a great job you must admit? 

[Born Hunter 17,646]

1 minute ago, Greb147 said:

Great, so you have to delve back 150 years to the time of the civil war as evidence it doesn't work. 

We are living in the most peaceful times in history, racial tension is better than all out war. 

That just shows how everyone can buy in to a myth, its been doing a great job you must admit? 

No I don't have to delve back 150 years LOL. Just seemed a somewhat significant event. You seriously telling me you think there's no ethnic or racial problems in the USA?

Yes the USA is doing good, but it's arguably in spite of ethnic diversity not because of it. Their diversity has been the cause of a hell of a lot of troubled history.

[JDHUNTING 1,817]

14 minutes ago, Greb147 said:

The difference is we do have a conscience and on the whole no right from wrong. 

We have a conscience because we're pack animals, same as Lions have a conscience to their own but none to strangers it's an evolutionary trait as we have to have empathy to raise our young. Were else apart from modern day humans in all of nature anywhere, including all animals and plants does a group or Individual lesser there own offsprings chance of success to benefit another group or species or anything.

I think nature is proving right now one way or another that you can't stand in its way, if we don't limit our numbers through war ourselves then one way or another it will happen humans can't keep breeding exponentially as we are doing and if we were closer to our base instincts we wouldn't let it get to disease or famine or simply stopping reproducing we would Duke it out and that's why we've evolved to were we are today and that's why we sharpened a stick in the first place and took that sharp stick all the way to an ICBM

[Greb147 6,808]

2 minutes ago, Born Hunter said:

No I don't have to delve back 150 years LOL. Just seemed a somewhat significant event. You seriously telling me you think there's no ethnic or racial problems in the USA?

Yes the USA is doing good, but it's arguably in spite of ethnic diversity not because of it. Their diversity has been the cause of a hell of a lot of troubled history.

Yes it was very significant but it wasn't just a war over slavery even if it was a major factor. 

Of course there is, is there any wonder with what happened in the past? 

Hundreds of years of repression and discrimination wasn't a great start to seeing eye to eye. 

[Born Hunter 17,646]

Just now, Greb147 said:

Yes it was very significant but it wasn't just a war over slavery even if it was a major factor. 

Of course there is, is there any wonder with what happened in the past? 

Hundreds of years of repression and discrimination wasn't a great start to seeing eye to eye. 

Exactly. My point is that I don't think the USA is really a shining example to counter Stan's statement that mashing different peoples together is a bad idea.

They've done great but I'd put that down to geography, resources and ideology, not diversity imo. I'm not sure it's particularly held them back much but it's made the ride a rough one.