Before The Media Spin Starts!!

[gonetoearth 5,144]

What annoys me is the bleeding heart socialists and unions campaigning for their own little corner, which compared to the rest of the country is surprisingly well off. At the end of the day there isnt this endless money pot for public sector pensions. I work in the public sector, ive had a pay freeze and a pension change. My pension was very good, will still pretty decent, and if you compare it to what can be gotten in the private sector its unbelievable. You cant really expect the rest of the country to pay for your pension when they can hardly afford to feed there kids can you? At the end of the day if its so bad, quit, do something else. I wont quit my job because i cant get anything like it in the real world. I can imagine its the same for you guys. When you hold the countries feet over coals (ironic) about something like this you will get some resentment but you cant blame people can you?

. Just out of interest what do you do buch

[pegleg33 134]

Well I'm sorry but I work in the construction industry and while the recession has been in place I've found it hard to get work and I've known of a couple of jobs I've lost to a fireman who's topping up his well paid first job by being able to undercut tradesmen who rely on only one job. Like I said until firefighters are honest with their total earnings do you really think I'm going to feel sorry for someone who's raking it in in other ways?.

[B.P.R 2,798]

The fire service want a 40% pay rise to 30k?

 

What about the military?.... NHS workers?.... and the like? ?...

 

The army will have to step in...work those extra hours.... to wipe your arses....and get FOOK ALL FOR IT!

[nothernlite 18,030]

Well I'm sorry but I work in the construction industry and while the recession has been in place I've found it hard to get work and I've known of a couple of jobs I've lost to a fireman who's topping up his well paid first job by being able to undercut tradesmen who rely on only one job. Like I said until firefighters are honest with their total earnings do you really think I'm going to feel sorry for someone who's raking it in in other ways?.

as i said earlier i was on a job and it was all firemen of the nightshift and they were getting £120 in there hand a day joiners plumbers and sparks

[OldTrapCollector 376]

The fire service want a 40% pay rise to 30k?

 

What about the military?.... NHS workers?.... and the like? ?...

 

The army will have to step in...work those extra hours.... to wipe your arses....and get FOOK ALL FOR IT!

 

I agree with you BPR - no chance of the British Armed Forces (not just the Army) saying no, and I am pretty sure that their pension scheme is getting trashed next year too ...

 

OTC

[B.P.R 2,798]

 

The fire service want a 40% pay rise to 30k?

What about the military?.... NHS workers?.... and the like? ?...

The army will have to step in...work those extra hours.... to wipe your arses....and get FOOK ALL FOR IT!

 

I agree with you BPR - no chance of the British Armed Forces (not just the Army) saying no, and I am pretty sure that their pension scheme is getting trashed next year too ...

 

OTC

Cant say no..... just doesnt happen...

 

Army is a job where you dont get asked to do anything...you get told....

 

Taking people away from their families in return for jack shiit.... fcuk that!

[WILF 44,478]

I am a big fan of the fire service and admire them greatly.......however, this thread smells a little too "union" for my liking.

 

AND

 

The amount you earn from a job should have absolutely nothing to do with the quality of service you provide so don't start all that old bollocks..........brickies, plasterers etc have been seeing their wages go up and down all their working life but they still have to do a good job in order to get paid at all

 

So, you will have to do a bit more and get a bit less?.........join the f***ing club mate!

[Nik_B 3,790]

think its all the private sector not just firemen and women

 

It is my wife's a teacher and she's had her contract changed as well.

 

It would be better to get rid of the final salary pension all together that way people can chose to retire earlier and live on a bit less and also if they chose to they can put more away each month if they plan to retire early.

 

The real problem with final salary pensions is that doctors and highly paid managers are on them as well, we're talking people earning over £100,000 retiring on £40,000 minimum.

 

To add insult to injury even if you have worked really hard in the private sector you're pension pot is capped at 1.2 million pounds, that may sound a lot but today if you bought an annuity it would only pay you about the same so someone in the public sector who was on 200,000 (and yes there are plenty of people like that) isn't affected by the cap at all.

 

Final salary pensions come from teh days people didn't live more that a few years after retirement, they are unrealistic and unsustainable. I do feel for the front line public sector people like teachers, nurses and firemen as they seem to be getting unfair stick in the news papers but they also traditionally are labour supporters and it's labour that has created this enormous public sector in the first place....jobs for the boys and paying for voters.

 

By the way to the OP do you really put 14% of your wages in to your pension or are you including the contributions from your employer?

 

I have to put 25% of mine away but I have a plan....I don't want to work after I am 60

[bwfc 164]

My son is a fireman in the RAF.He is on standby to take over with the strike,but the reality is that they dont have enough firemen to cover it.The firemen have been leaving the forces through redundancy and just because the pay is absolutely shit!!.Civvy firemen get paid far more than my son,who is actually better qualified than a normal firefighter.

Going back to the strikes they have about 250 qualified firefighters to cover the whole frigging country,so they are using the army lads.So for each area you will get one qualified fireman and 3 army lads who have had a fortnights fire training.So basically the goverment/mod think its okay to put men into a fire after only two weeks training. A convicted prisoner in jail has more rights than our service lads,and are better looked after,fact!!!!.

[Mickey Finn 2,759]

NIK_B if you can save 25% of your pay. Your doing OK brother.

 

I'm sorry to keep jumping in on some of these threads. But, I'm seeing some similarities with the US. There seems to be a situation where working folks have taken the brunt of the hits in the past few decades. While the upper wage earners are doing just fine. The problem I see is working people attacking the earnings of other workers instead of the earnings of the upper percentile of earners. This is a dangerous trend that will leave all of us in the lurch.

 

Public sector workers over here tend to be unionized. So, while they started making far less than the private sector workers. Through the years they've negotiated more for themselves. Now while the private sector who is not organized gets what their boss cares to pay them. Public sector workers still have some benefit from contracts etc.

 

Improving everybody's pay should be our goal.

 

ATB

[Nik_B 3,790]

NIK_B if you can save 25% of your pay. Your doing OK brother.

 

I'm sorry to keep jumping in on some of these threads. But, I'm seeing some similarities with the US. There seems to be a situation where working folks have taken the brunt of the hits in the past few decades. While the upper wage earners are doing just fine. The problem I see is working people attacking the earnings of other workers instead of the earnings of the upper percentile of earners. This is a dangerous trend that will leave all of us in the lurch.

 

Public sector workers over here tend to be unionized. So, while they started making far less than the private sector workers. Through the years they've negotiated more for themselves. Now while the private sector who is not organized gets what their boss cares to pay them. Public sector workers still have some benefit from contracts etc.

 

Improving everybody's pay should be our goal.

 

ATB

 

Yes you're right there are similarities, we are heading down the road towards the US system if we are not careful. Basically there are many things in the UK that are much better that the US like our NHS system, pensions and social welfare system for example but the problem is that people then treat them as a god given right. These great things have to be paid for by the tax payer and especially by people who are working that bit harder just to have a little more, and now those people are getting slapped with more taxes to the point where you wonder what the benefit is considering you might be shortening your life span through stress and overwork.

 

Public sector workers in the UK now earn significantly more money that private sector workers and on top of that they will get a gold plated final salary pension that is not affected by the stock market or bad annuity rates. While it sucks that they are having to work a bit longer they are still miles better off that the private sector worker and the irony is that we wouldn't be able to afford such luxurious pensions if it wasn't for the private sector tax payer. It seems very unfair that austerity should only affect one half of the UK workers and not touch the others.

 

One thing you are especially right about is the divisive nature of the whole thing, they've turned the workers against each other while the highly paid managers who basically do nothing to contribute are still earning money you would simply not believe! Head of BBC human resources was on over £300,000 per year plus final salry pension, council bosses routinely earn way more than the prime minister, Head teachers (who don't do any teaching at all) earn ,000-90,000 plus, police and fire service bosses no doubt earn sickening wages and don't dirty their hands.

 

Final salary pensions should be for the poorly/low paid, the rest should have to contribute much more.

[JDHUNTING 1,817]

Ill have to work till im 67 atleast as will most others, ill will have worked atleast twice as hard with less holidays and perks than most public sector workers so you wont be getting sympathy from me. Also as an emergency service you shouldnt be able to strike we pay your wages to provide a service, shame on you.

[neems 2,406]

would like to think there were still fit at 50 onwards with all the training facilitys they have at there place of work or should i say gym

Ffs,so you actually believe a very fit 30 year old is no fitter than someone in their 50s... Because they went to the gym.

 

What about year olds?

 

In fact why even have an age limit?

[twobob 1,459]

 

Please help educate as many people as possible about the facts and in this day and age we are able to have a big influence on the media machine!!!

 

Over the next few weeks, the public are going to hear stories in the media about 'greedy, ungrateful, lazy firefighters' that want to strike over their 'gold plated, expens...ive to the tax-payer, generous pensions' that are 'given' to them by the government, and that our pensions are the 'best around'.

 

The facts are these, I pay 14% into my pension, £400 per month (feel free to compare that to what any of you pay). The Gov are changing my pension and are going to make me work an EXTRA 10years to receive a LOWER pension, making me work until I'm 60. Over that 10years ill pay an EXTRA £45,000 into MY pension, and receive less per year than I would of under the current scheme! If I'm lucky to live until I'm then this change will cost me PERSONALLY over £100,000!

 

Would you want a 60year old male or female firefighter coming into your home to rescue you and your

family?

 

On top of this, they are bringing in a new scheme, that if I don't meet their fitness standards at 50-60, they can dismiss me and keep ALL my pension until I'm 67. So the 40odd years of paying £400 a month into the scheme, they would keep! The Gov themselves had an independent review done that found it would be highly unlikely for FFs to carry out the duties or meet the fitness standards at age 60. They are now ignoring their own review!

 

It's true that under my current scheme I retire at 50 having worked 30 years. They might seem early to many people, but it's because I pay in the 14% and accumulate enough money to be able to retire at an earlier age. Maybe its a small perk for working Christmas Days, family Birthdays, Weekends and Evenings, and New Years etc for the 30 years as well as putting the publics safety before my own.

 

This Government are obsessed with tearing the public sector apart, this is the start. Mark my words that in a few years there will be talk of privatising the Fire Brigade and other public services. A way for the Government to make money off people's misery.

 

Firefighters need support, please ignore the medias spin on the facts. Firefighters DO NOT want to strike. But the Gov have us against the wall and are unwilling to listen to our concerns

 

freeze your pension put the 400 aweek in the sock draw when you finnish nobody knows about your tax free nest egg when you retire then come on here laughing at all these on here moaning about what the governments taking off em the doing it with part of the royal mail saying its losing 37 mil but the bloke running it just got 30odd percent pay rise did same with the tanker drivers 45 grand ayear how was it relevant how much they were on whenthe dispute was over safety,support you all the way if thats what you were promised thats what you should get :yes:

[keepdiggin 9,305]

 

Well I'm sorry but I work in the construction industry and while the recession has been in place I've found it hard to get work and I've known of a couple of jobs I've lost to a fireman who's topping up his well paid first job by being able to undercut tradesmen who rely on only one job. Like I said until firefighters are honest with their total earnings do you really think I'm going to feel sorry for someone who's raking it in in other ways?.

as i said earlier i was on a job and it was all firemen of the nightshift and they were getting £120 in there hand a day joiners plumbers and sparks

 

i'm a fully qualified spreader and don't get £120 a day these days.