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swanseajack

Working Bedlingtons 2005

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sorry to hear about you losing the dogs jack.

 

regarding john williams stock, as i said, i had one bitch of his breeding and she was a good worker, bred to a dessie mackin owned middleton lakeland, she produced good workers, i can't comment on the various other cross that he made.

 

there must be a lot of people still interested in the working bedlington, very time they get mentioned, its seems to run into several pages.

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Are the first two dog's on the first page purebreed bedlingtons or do they have a little bit of some thing else in them?

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Are the first two dog's on the first page purebreed bedlingtons or do they have a little bit of some thing else in them?

 

All my dogs have part Lakeland in them, Yogi is bred out of Tango/Rusty both were 3/4 Bed 1/4 Lakeland, same breeding diff litter Bron/Cochyn

 

Jack is out of Yogi and a bitch from Halifax again same lines.

 

1-picture2.gif.

 

Bitch on left has border/lakeland in her make up bred in Halifax. Bitch on right is full sister to Tango (3/4 Bed 1/4 Lakeland). These are pics taken mid 90's.

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How does the bedlington work when going to ground, will they just flush the fox or do they bay and kill it down there? In other words are they a hard dog like the lakeland and patts, I mean the dogs in general not just the lines you use. Because alot of people are saying that their not the most fiece of terriers anymore and the old bedlington is gone because of what the show breeders have done to them. They say they've lost that hard look in their eye.

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How does the bedlington work when going to ground, will they just flush the fox or do they bay and kill it down there? In other words are they a hard dog like the lakeland and patts, I mean the dogs in general not just the lines you use. Because alot of people are saying that their not the most fiece of terriers anymore and the old bedlington is gone because of what the show breeders have done to them. They say they've lost that hard look in their eye.

 

 

I can't and won't give a general opinion on Bedlingtons as I don't have the experience or knowledge, I can only give an opinion on what I work and it is just my opinion.

 

They work and work well, some of the progeny have been hard and as game as any terrier, Killing and drawin foxes, staying in tight awkard places taking and giving punishment til dug to or bolting from easy earths, some were only as good as the next average dog (be it Patterdale, Lakeland, Border or Russell) some just did not make the grade at all.

 

An outcross to a lakeland was used to put some fire back in this line, bring the size down and produce better coats, some would argue that it wasn't needed or should not have been done as 'pure' lines would be lost ?

 

There's litter wastage in every breed, if we could breed perfect dogs by simple methods every time, we'd all be breeding Racing Greyhounds or even race horses. If you strive to breed from only WORKING dogs then the litter wastage would reduce in time.

 

Different situations would account for whether an individual dog bolted the fox or stayed and finished the job off...

 

Perhaps other readers of this thread would like to comment on their own dogs, dogs they have seen working be it good or bad......

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Swanseajack

 

Merlin was thicker set, shorter on leg, although still long in the back....pups turned out a mixture of types (can't remember the sire, it was one of two dogs & I would be guessing)...I have heard some are still around, but who has them and do they work them I don't know.

 

Regards

 

Printer

Let's hope someone out there does know, be interesting to find out what they turned out like and if they are in working homes..

 

Hopefully they might post some pics ?

 

What dogs do you have Printer?

 

Swanseajack

 

I also have Bedlingtons, although most are pensioners now and I've not seriouslly worked them in the last 10 years. My first bitch a 3/4 bed 1/4 border called Bella (BluexVic) is the foundation to the line I keep, I put her to a pure Bedlington of the same lines and carried on from there.

 

I must admit after a break of 10 years and not really doing much with regards to the dogs I'm really looking foward to this coming season, I can only put it down to continually reading these forums and realising what I've been missing these last years.

 

Regards

 

Printer

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Just have to say a brilliant thread, really educational. And good piccies of how Bedlingtons should look. I live right next to Bedlington, and now only get to see the show stuff round here :no:

MOLL.

 

 

Was thinking the same myself Molly.... :clapper: .... :clapper:

 

SINDASOX :yes:

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What dogs do you have Printer?

 

Swanseajack

 

I also have Bedlingtons, although most are pensioners now and I've not seriouslly worked them in the last 10 years. My first bitch a 3/4 bed 1/4 border called Bella (BluexVic) is the foundation to the line I keep, I put her to a pure Bedlington of the same lines and carried on from there.

 

I must admit after a break of 10 years and not really doing much with regards to the dogs I'm really looking foward to this coming season, I can only put it down to continually reading these forums and realising what I've been missing these last years.

 

Regards

 

Printer

 

 

Good luck with the coming season Printer

 

You'll soon see what you've been missing, and wonder why you ever stopped. Hope the dogs new and old go well, keep us informed.

 

Perhaps if you got some time you will post some pics of the dogs you have, or old pics would be interesting..

 

Swanseajack..

 

3-picture2.gif

A pic of Rusty, he was a bit of a Big dog and struggled to get in small earths, but a double handful when it came to work.

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Just have to say a brilliant thread, really educational. And good piccies of how Bedlingtons should look. I live right next to Bedlington, and now only get to see the show stuff round here :no:

MOLL.

 

 

Was thinking the same myself Molly.... :clapper: .... :clapper:

 

SINDASOX :yes:

 

Thanks Molly and Sindasox, glad you like it, let's hope we have a few more postings and pics.

 

3-picture3.gif

 

Lurcher is Gantry, mixed bed/whippet breeding. Bedlington is Tango.

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How does the bedlington work when going to ground, will they just flush the fox or do they bay and kill it down there? In other words are they a hard dog like the lakeland and patts, I mean the dogs in general not just the lines you use. Because alot of people are saying that their not the most fiece of terriers anymore and the old bedlington is gone because of what the show breeders have done to them. They say they've lost that hard look in their eye.

 

 

I can't and won't give a general opinion on Bedlingtons as I don't have the experience or knowledge, I can only give an opinion on what I work and it is just my opinion.

 

They work and work well, some of the progeny have been hard and as game as any terrier, Killing and drawin foxes, staying in tight awkard places taking and giving punishment til dug to or bolting from easy earths, some were only as good as the next average dog (be it Patterdale, Lakeland, Border or Russell) some just did not make the grade at all.

 

An outcross to a lakeland was used to put some fire back in this line, bring the size down and produce better coats, some would argue that it wasn't needed or should not have been done as 'pure' lines would be lost ?

 

There's litter wastage in every breed, if we could breed perfect dogs by simple methods every time, we'd all be breeding Racing Greyhounds or even race horses. If you strive to breed from only WORKING dogs then the litter wastage would reduce in time.

 

Different situations would account for whether an individual dog bolted the fox or stayed and finished the job off...

 

Perhaps other readers of this thread would like to comment on their own dogs, dogs they have seen working be it good or bad......

 

Very good post that

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Guest Fell & Moorland WTC SW area

Can a Bedlington Fan explain to me, when is a Bedlington not a Bedlington? I know from many previous discussions over the Years that all Dogs have different Breeds in them in Days gone by, during their foundation Years. When is a Bedlington a pure one 'so to speak', with Bedlington from the great,great grand Parents or further back?

Lakeland, Border and Bedlington crosses of various percentages seem to be the norm. Are these considered to be pure Bedlingtons? If they are not considered pure, then any posts about working Bedlingtons cannot include these crosses?

 

It seems to be the only Breed where crosses don't make it a crossbred. A Patterdale isn't one if it has Russell in it's make up, it is a Patt/Russell cross. A Border with Lakeland in it is a Border/Lakie cross. I know about how different Breeds were crossed during foundation periods to form a Breed of Dog, but Bedlingtons have been crossed up very recently (in Breed terms) and aren't described as crossbred.

 

Bedlington fans please explain. ;)

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Can a Bedlington Fan explain to me, when is a Bedlington not a Bedlington? I know from many previous discussions over the Years that all Dogs have different Breeds in them in Days gone by, during their foundation Years. When is a Bedlington a pure one 'so to speak', with Bedlington from the great,great grand Parents or further back?

Lakeland, Border and Bedlington crosses of various percentages seem to be the norm. Are these considered to be pure Bedlingtons? If they are not considered pure, then any posts about working Bedlingtons cannot include these crosses?

 

It seems to be the only Breed where crosses don't make it a crossbred. A Patterdale isn't one if it has Russell in it's make up, it is a Patt/Russell cross. A Border with Lakeland in it is a Border/Lakie cross. I know about how different Breeds were crossed during foundation periods to form a Breed of Dog, but Bedlingtons have been crossed up very recently (in Breed terms)  and aren't described as crossbred.

 

Bedlington fans please explain.  ;)

 

 

Good question and not unexpected, I'm sure the purists out there will have all the 'correct' answers to this, but I'll put my tuppence worth in for what it's worth.

 

"A Patterdale isn't one if it has Russell in it's make up, it is a Patt/Russell cross. A Border with Lakeland in it is a Border/Lakie cross."

 

To quote what you've already stated above, When the pat/russell cross is bred back to a pat, it becomes a Pat with a lil bit of Russell in it, breed these back to another pat and as long as they look like pats they invariably became pats or that's what the owners would have you believe.

 

Crossing Russells back to Fell/Lakeland dogs 1st cross is Russell/Lakeland second cross back to whichever side becomes whatever it looks like, Is it a White Fell, Russell or what, history will hide facts that are bad and the bias will be on the good??

 

You've only got to look at the variations in all breeds to see that somewhere along the lines something else has been added, be it Bull in the pats, lakeland in the russells, borders in the lakelands.

 

 

Same goes for all crossbreds, there are and always will be owners that will outcross their dogs for whatever reason good luck to them, what they turn out like is what they are called be it 1st, 2nd or 3rd progeny.

 

Again purists will argue, all those who have kept the same lines for generations will argue..... carry on, all the purist of any breed who have kept the same lines 'WELL DONE'

 

I'll call them BEDLINGTONS if any want's to call them mongrels go ahead, but I hide nothing as I've stated clearly what's been used in this line is a 'LAKELAND',

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The argument will never change as to whether to keep dogs pure bred or not,or when they cease to be called beddies.

This used to frustrate the great G N.

personaly although i leave the breeding to others i have had both good and not so good dogs in pure and outcross beddies.

Outcrossing if done right will improve any breed and lets face it many people who show dogs of all breeds outcross behind closed doors to improve their chances of a rosette or two but will ridicule anyone else that gets caught doing it especialy the likes of GN who told friends etc of his intentions.

If i am honest my two best dogs where both beddie crosses.

Zimba was a bed X Whippet but stayed small enough to go to ground she did fox rat and rabbit her party piece was to stalk ducks in reed beds and bring them back to hand live she was feared of man nor beast.

Jade well she was as hard as nails did her first fox at 10 months (went to ground while out catching rabbits and killed a large dog fox), The only problem i had with her was she also thought other dogs where fair game and attacked any who growled or tried to show dominance this eventualy led to her demise. she was bred by GN from Dan and Dart and i believe was 5/8 bedlinton 3/8 border.Jade can be seen in the working bedlington year book 1997 and her bro biff in 1998 year book

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The argument will never change as to whether to keep dogs pure bred or not,or when they cease to be called beddies.

This used to frustrate the great G N.

personaly although i leave the breeding to others i have had both good and not so good dogs in pure and outcross beddies.

Outcrossing if done right will improve any breed and lets face it many people who show dogs of all breeds outcross behind closed doors to improve their chances of a rosette or two but will ridicule anyone else that gets caught doing it especialy the likes of GN who told friends etc of his intentions.

If i am honest my two best dogs where both beddie crosses.

Zimba was a bed X Whippet but stayed small enough to go to ground she did fox rat and rabbit her party piece was to stalk ducks in reed beds and bring them back to hand live she was feared of man nor beast.

Jade well she was as hard as nails did her first fox at 10 months (went to ground while out catching rabbits and killed a large dog fox), The only problem i had with her was she also thought other dogs where fair game and attacked any who growled or tried to show dominance this eventualy led to her demise. she was bred by GN from Dan and Dart and i believe was 5/8 bedlinton 3/8 border.Jade can be seen in the working bedlington year book 1997 and her bro biff in 1998 year book

 

hope your don't mind me sticking this up dave, have always admired your bitck from the year book.

dfd3vd.th.jpg

dave's bitch jade.

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