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48 minutes ago, gnasher16 said:

You'll get dogs who work differently you might get a defensive dog thats going to hold out on the ear and frustrate the other dog....you'll get the barnstormers that are just going to find their way to the chest or neck....you might get a stifle dog who works out that the other dog doesnt have the reach to pull him off...y...or yes you might just have a low ability dog who cant fight but still wants to win thats the beauty of gameness.....you'll get all types but you cant make a dog fight in any other way than what he knows theres no sparring....every contact a dog has takes out of him so you're not going to get him bashed up for no reason.

Gameness is everything regardless of fitness but my view is that supreme levels of fitness can hide the cur in a dog and ultimately mean the inferior dog can possibly beat his more talented opponent.

Cheers, that's what I was getting at lol. Suppose there's no preparing for an opponent as if you would boxing etc and it's just what happens on the day

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Nice read that was i couldnt " like " it for some reason....i think the pit bulls were addictive a lot of young lads of our generation had a healthy respect for their physical prowess and that was goo

Most pics of dogs that went through my hands mate ended up with the dead chap spoken about on this topic !....and it wouldnt be right to show other peoples dogs but this is a dog im fairly close to on

My APBT Max.

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1 hour ago, gnasher16 said:

No Mchull wormed and flead should be second nature all year round regardless,nobody should start any form of exercise with an unhealthy dog.....im talking about preparing a dog for hard work i used to pre keep a dog on a very low fat diet maybe cooked chicken,chicken broth,small cup of all bran,sometimes a couple cloves of chopped garlic...some folk used to say raw garlic was slightly toxic and was too hard on the dogs stomach lining but i found if you cooked it there was no problem and it was a natural anti inflammatory.

Getting rid of what we called the gut fat was essential to do before working a dog hard but it wasnt just about the intestines it was all the internal fat around the heart,lungs,liver....id hand walk a dog around 5 or 6 miles every day for those first 4 weeks you want to bring his weight down within easy reach of his show weight without stressing his cardio system then once the pre keep was done you'd gradually start upping the fats as the real work starts.

All dogs are different id say theres nothing worse than following a hand written keep all dogs progress at different rates all keeps should be tailored to the individual dog but pre keeping a dog is set in stone in my opinion it has to be done right in the same way the foundations of a house have to be done right....but build the house however you like.

I could talk conditioning for days i love the subject but i dont want to sound too anal and engrossed in it......oh ok too late 😆

i wont worm and flea all year gnash twice a year now for me just before season end a summer and at march time i never had any issues with out mainly use advocate and a droncit tablet 

i’ll lead walk all spring summer anyway 

the bulldogs just kennelled until you have a show planned? 

all bran weetabix would be like feeding a cheap kibble what do you think all bran does ? 

id always feed abit a fibre all year round 👍

 

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49 minutes ago, mC HULL said:

i wont worm and flea all year gnash twice a year now for me just before season end a summer and at march time i never had any issues with out mainly use advocate and a droncit tablet 

i’ll lead walk all spring summer anyway 

the bulldogs just kennelled until you have a show planned? 

all bran weetabix would be like feeding a cheap kibble what do you think all bran does ? 

id always feed abit a fibre all year round 👍

 

It's a bulker; dog gets correct weight of food with no goodness so it strips out the internal fat

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12 minutes ago, South hams hunter said:

It's a bulker; dog gets correct weight of food with no goodness so it strips out the internal fat

and shits like a cow pats all over ? 

bulk the food out with shite to lose fat seems a lazy way to me ?

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1 hour ago, mC HULL said:

i wont worm and flea all year gnash twice a year now for me just before season end a summer and at march time i never had any issues with out mainly use advocate and a droncit tablet 

i’ll lead walk all spring summer anyway 

the bulldogs just kennelled until you have a show planned? 

all bran weetabix would be like feeding a cheap kibble what do you think all bran does ? 

id always feed abit a fibre all year round 👍

 

You have to be constantly thinking about how a dog converts their energy from nutrients and it doesnt come from high protein and carbs,high protein and carbs leads to less oxygen and a lower red blood count....all bran is high carbs/low fat and should only be for the 4 week pre keep.....you are stripping out the internal fat and bringing the dogs weight down with carbs......at the end of the pre keep and the start of the real work the increase in performance comes when you ditch the carbs and increase the fat content....alternatively you can use brown rice instead of all bran but it has to be cooked twice and thats too much f****n about.

 

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I have read, (and enjoyed) but tried to keep out of this thread, as game dogs create an itch that can’t be scratched. 
 

The UK scene had many great contests. 
When two the sons of Ried’s Skipper met, Scotsman’s Max v Priests Iron Billy. 
Yarrakin had enough faith to travel a long way with his charge and challenged a champion, Curstopper v Ch Sunny.

The fireworks that the Nelis x Tug combination created, which Gnasher has alluded to, and lesser know individual dogs, that made their name in the trenches, little known maybe, but appreciated by those that witnessed their work, dogs like Billy Broken Tail, Scar and his brother the Dentist and the best ear dog I’ve ever seen on two continents, the Compo dog, who rarely had a tooth in him such was his abilities. 
Another time, another world almost…much admiration, no regrets  

 

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17 hours ago, gnasher16 said:

You'll get dogs who work differently you might get a defensive dog thats going to hold out on the ear and frustrate the other dog....you'll get the barnstormers that are just going to find their way to the chest or neck....you might get a stifle dog who works out that the other dog doesnt have the reach to pull him off...y...or yes you might just have a low ability dog who cant fight but still wants to win thats the beauty of gameness.....you'll get all types but you cant make a dog fight in any other way than what he knows theres no sparring....every contact a dog has takes out of him so you're not going to get him bashed up for no reason.

Gameness is everything regardless of fitness but my view is that supreme levels of fitness can hide the cur in a dog and ultimately mean the inferior dog can possibly beat his more talented opponent or outlast a gamer dog.

was it the case of a better handler/keeper been the difference between two dogs as in my dog is more talented but he gets his a little bit better at the right time and beats me.

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5 hours ago, PMul said:

I have read, (and enjoyed) but tried to keep out of this thread, as game dogs create an itch that can’t be scratched. 
 

The UK scene had many great contests. 
When two the sons of Ried’s Skipper met, Scotsman’s Max v Priests Iron Billy. 
Yarrakin had enough faith to travel a long way with his charge and challenged a champion, Curstopper v Ch Sunny.

The fireworks that the Nelis x Tug combination created, which Gnasher has alluded to, and lesser know individual dogs, that made their name in the trenches, little known maybe, but appreciated by those that witnessed their work, dogs like Billy Broken Tail, Scar and his brother the Dentist and the best ear dog I’ve ever seen on two continents, the Compo dog, who rarely had a tooth in him such was his abilities. 
Another time, another world almost…much admiration, no regrets  

 

Cracking little post boss its nice to hear another voice apart from my own monotonous tones !....i like to natter about the workings of the sport but slightly hesitant to discuss dogs or even the owners of dogs who having been out the game many years i have no idea what they're up to now but your first and last lines hit the nail on the head for me.....its an itch that cant be scratched but you come to terms with it and replace like for like......and another world,admiration but no regrets.....nicely put.

As for some little known dogs under appreciated Dillon,Billy,Grizzly,Cheyney all spring to mind and of course Klogger....Jacko of course was one of them soulless individuals that wanted to eat the opponent alive in front of your eyes but being a Spike/Nelis/Tug fan most memories start and end in the same family.

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4 hours ago, big sid said:

was it the case of a better handler/keeper been the difference between two dogs as in my dog is more talented but he gets his a little bit better at the right time and beats me.

It could be mate exactly....the best dog didnt always come out victorious and as a conditioner thats where you earned your keep so to speak.....agai, having a super fit dog often hid the fact he was a cur but he simply outlasted the gamer higher ability opponent.

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6 minutes ago, gnasher16 said:

Cracking little post boss its nice to hear another voice apart from my own monotonous tones !....i like to natter about the workings of the sport but slightly hesitant to discuss dogs or even the owners of dogs who having been out the game many years i have no idea what they're up to now but your first and last lines hit the nail on the head for me.....its an itch that cant be scratched but you come to terms with it and replace like for like......and another world,admiration but no regrets.....nicely put.

As for some little known dogs under appreciated Dillon,Billy,Grizzly,Cheyney all spring to mind and of course Klogger....Jacko of course was one of them soulless individuals that wanted to eat the opponent alive in front of your eyes but being a Spike/Nelis/Tug fan most memories start and end in the same family.

Was the Dillon dog you mentioned down from Klogger?

 I owed a gyp down from Nelis thru Will cap’s Domino. Really nice type that quit at 40 minutes after asking for more that she had. 
 

The best (gamest I ever had) where down from a PP bitch, direct from his yard, also the stuff down from Carrs Bullit. 
 

Far away days….

 

 

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4 hours ago, big sid said:

was it the case of a better handler/keeper been the difference between two dogs as in my dog is more talented but he gets his a little bit better at the right time and beats me.

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. 
Give me a GAME dog that can breath and 9x outa 10 we take your money. 

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20 minutes ago, gnasher16 said:

Cracking little post boss its nice to hear another voice apart from my own monotonous tones !....i like to natter about the workings of the sport but slightly hesitant to discuss dogs or even the owners of dogs who having been out the game many years i have no idea what they're up to now but your first and last lines hit the nail on the head for me.....its an itch that cant be scratched but you come to terms with it and replace like for like......and another world,admiration but no regrets.....nicely put.

As for some little known dogs under appreciated Dillon,Billy,Grizzly,Cheyney all spring to mind and of course Klogger....Jacko of course was one of them soulless individuals that wanted to eat the opponent alive in front of your eyes but being a Spike/Nelis/Tug fan most memories start and end in the same family.

I agree. 
I only use the handles they have used publicly. 
All have moved on, some passed on. 
No one that I know owns a real bulldog now. 
Good to hear the old stuff being mentioned now and again. 

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22 minutes ago, PMul said:

Was the Dillon dog you mentioned down from Klogger?

 I owed a gyp down from Nelis thru Will cap’s Domino. Really nice type that quit at 40 minutes after asking for more that she had. 
 

The best (gamest I ever had) where down from a PP bitch, direct from his yard, also the stuff down from Carrs Bullit. 
 

Far away days….

 

 

Dillon and Klogger were littermates....Cheyney was a son of Dillon ( if memory serves me correct ).....all them double Buzz dogs which seemed popular at the time.

How was Domino bred ?.....in terms of quitters the Nelis blood didnt stack up particularly well but they were crafty calculated match dogs that suited s certain type of conditioning.

Patricks stuff i was never really around too much though can fully appreciate the Tombstone/Bolio stuff that hit these shores.....indeed,good days.

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