Shooting Elephants

[DIDO.1 20,864]

I can't see the point of standing on a peg and shooting tame pheasants, why not get your jollies from shooting clay pigeons.

 

I'd ban it cos I don't understand it.

Aren't grey partridges on the danger list? We should ban shooting them....cos if we don't shoot them there will be more of them right?

[Lab 10,979]

I can't see the point of standing on a peg and shooting tame pheasants, why not get your jollies from shooting clay pigeons.

 

I'd ban it cos I don't understand it.

Aren't grey partridges on the danger list? We should ban shooting them....cos if we don't shoot them there will be more of them right?

I'd ban grouse shooting as its too expensive for me.....boo hoo....?

[Hydropotesinermis 724]

More humans in Leeds JD than elephants in the whole of the African Continent.

 

Not exactly mass

WTF does that have to do with anything?

[stealthy1 3,964]

Anyone read Death in the long grass?

[J Darcy 5,871]

Anyone read Death in the long grass?

Capstick's da man!

[mackem 23,783]

Anyone read Death in the long grass?

 

Excellent read.

[mackem 23,783]

Good job the tusker wasnt anthropormorphised with a name like Ellie the elephant,then the guy who shot it really would be up shit creek without a paddle,even though his hunt was entirely legitimate.

[Brewman 1,190]

Taking into consideration that this has turned out to be an emotive topic anything I say isn't aimed at anyone.

Elephants are majestic and beautiful creatures which are unfortunately hunted in a cruel manner for their ivory. Maybe hunting is a wrong word to use.

Possibly because they are the largest land mammal is why it's revered by many including hunters and non hunters alike and shouldn't be hunted at all. I can understand and respect that.

 

Unfortunately I don't see it so black and white. In some areas they do literally wreak havoc with people's lives and livelihood. Some do have to be culled so I see no reason why they could not be culled by hunters with more money than sense as long as the appropriate factors and supervision are in place.

 

Elephants because of their size can't be easily transported from one area to another as can be other animals.

They can't be tranquilised like other animals as after an hour on their side their internal organs start crushing themselves thus leading to death. Try putting a wild or mildly dosed elephant that comes around in a crate and think about how nuts it will go. If Nellie doesn't damage the crate she'll injure herself possibly badly.

While they are an endangered species there is a place for culling and thus canned hunting.

It wouldn't ever float my boat but if ever wealthy enough I would do it just to get as close as possible without a kill.

If done properly and the fee goes towards the management and future conservation of the species then I'm all for it.

[Born Hunter 17,638]

Can we at least get one thing straight, the African Elephant is NOT classified as endangered. That's by the IUCN!

 

They classify it as Vulnerable, which means it is considered at risk of becoming endangered but NOT endangered.

 

And even if it was, sport hunting has literally brought species from very sorry states of endangerment to much healthier population status! Everybody goes on about how it makes them 'feel', it's apparently the way to think in the 21stC.... we've completely forgotten how to be sensible and objective.

[Brewman 1,190]

BH I stand corrected, it was CITES I went by and not by the IUCN.

However my point being the same as yours even if endangered, managed culling/hunting can very easily have its place.

[Born Hunter 17,638]

BH I stand corrected, it was CITES I went by and not by the IUCN.

However my point being the same as yours even if endangered, managed culling/hunting can very easily have its place.

 

No probs, but the only CITES info I can find follows the guidance of the IUCN......?

 

It's my understanding that CITES are very closely linked to the IUCN also, but with a more specific mandate.

 

Edit;

This might be out of date?

https://cites.org/eng/com/sc/61/E61-44-02-A1.pdf

 

CITES listing status and IUCN Red List status

All populations of African elephant have been listed on CITES Appendix I since 1989, except for four national populations that were transferred to Appendix II (Botswana, Namibia and Zimbabwe in 1997, and South Africa in 2000). The African elephant is currently listed as Vulnerable (A2a; Ver 3.1; Blanc, 2008) on the IUCN Red List.

Edited October 20, 2015 by Born Hunter

[stealthy1 3,964]

I have to say I quite fancy a go at an Elephant, but as Capstick did it. One shot, iron sights, .475 inch (12 mm) bullet. I don't think the rifle would have been that accurate over a distance, so it's a close up shot or nothing. And if you miss, your road pizza. Bull Elephant racing towards you in a rage, the Elephants trumpeting would be deafening by the time it was in range. Now it's just you and your quarry, if you miss your dead, if you make the shot, he's dead. If your hearts not racing, your already dead.

[Brewman 1,190]

I looked on the CITES website so the classification of both elephants are up to date.

CITES and IUCN work closely on the MILK (monitoring of illigal killing of elephants.

IUCN is the older of the 2 groups and would appear to have more resources at their disposal probably because less red tape from being a not for profit international non government organisation.

[Born Hunter 17,638]

Okay, but aren't I right in saying that CITES do not classify as endangered, vulnerable etc? They classify by their appendices system, of which there are three. Any reference to endangered or vulnerable is a reference to the IUCN classification. The two systems are for two different ends.

 

The African Elephant for the most part falls under Appendix I, which means CITES considers them threatened with extinction. But any IUCN classified animal can be threatened with extinction, so it's not something that alone should be cause for environmentalist excitement or mean they are endangered.

 

What I'm getting at is that I still don't believe that they are classified as endangered by any respected organisation, unless I have it round my neck?

Edited October 20, 2015 by Born Hunter

[Brewman 1,190]

Not as far as I'm aware now that I've looked at it a bit more in depth. People have bandied about the endangered species wording myself included probably after just hearing it over the years being applied probably incorrectly by the media and others.