chartpolski 28,163 Posted 2 hours ago Report Share Posted 2 hours ago 1 hour ago, WILF said: There is one being suggested, Rupert Lowe has said it out loud…..re-migration as he calls it. But reform chucked out Rupert Lowe and got themselves a Nadine Dorries instead !……does that not trigger even the slightest alarm bell ? Wilf , the “Overton Window “ is moving rightward, but it will never move far enough to Lowes right . The window represents the populations general consensus, and at the moment, we have a left wing government that completely rejects the direction of the window and the will of the people. Farage is a very shrewd politician and is saying what the window tells him the people want, I just hope his intentions match his rhetoric . Lowe, even though I agree with much of what he says, would be an anathema to the “middle ground” voters and without them he has absolutely no chance of ever forming a government. Theres a thing called “Real Politik”, politicians will NEVER move to far, either left or right, if they hope to form a government. Lowe is seen as the rights equivalent of Corbyn. People won’t vote for what they see as “extremists”. As I keep saying; no one is offering a VIABLE alternative , when some one does, I’ll listen to it. Cheers. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
WILF 50,660 Posted 1 hour ago Report Share Posted 1 hour ago (edited) 27 minutes ago, chartpolski said: Wilf , the “Overton Window “ is moving rightward, but it will never move far enough to Lowes right . The window represents the populations general consensus, and at the moment, we have a left wing government that completely rejects the direction of the window and the will of the people. My worry?, argument?, point ?…..whatever we want call it is, if we don’t vote for it then it will be out of our hands. The “population” needs a reality check !…….are they happy to die, yes or no ? Do they want to deal with it in a logical, humane way or do they want events to spin out of control whereby they do die or we get to killing each other ? Yes or No ? Never mind Overton windows, I think it’s completely irresponsible to not just tell the truth about this……as I’ve said before, we don’t have the excuse of “we don’t know” or “we didn’t have access to lots of different quality information” ……we have all that and given that we do isn’t it incumbent on us to not just blindly get behind the first lifebelt that floats past ?…..shouldn’t we be demanding the people we are lending support to are on the case in a serious way and not trying to bullshit us ? Quote Farage is a very shrewd politician and is saying what the window tells him the people want, I just hope his intentions match his rhetoric . Lowe, even though I agree with much of what he says, would be an anathema to the “middle ground” voters and without them he has absolutely no chance of ever forming a government. Theres a thing called “Real Politik”, politicians will NEVER move to far, either left or right, if they hope to form a government. Lowe is seen as the rights equivalent of Corbyn. People won’t vote for what they see as “extremists”. As I keep saying; no one is offering a VIABLE alternative , when some one does, I’ll listen to it. Cheers. Very fair, level headed view mate…..as always, it’s not an argument, it’s a conversation Edited 1 hour ago by WILF 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
WILF 50,660 Posted 1 hour ago Report Share Posted 1 hour ago 55 minutes ago, Seagull said: Was Bradford a ghetto when they were first shipped in, what about London? Bingo !……the thing that everyone finds ugly to say is that it isn’t about any other factor other than there presence ! The dye gets in the water as Enoch said. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chartpolski 28,163 Posted 1 hour ago Report Share Posted 1 hour ago 2 minutes ago, WILF said: My worry?, argument?, point ?…..whatever we want call it is, if we don’t vote for it then it will be out of our hands. The “population” needs a reality check !…….are they happy to die, yes or no ? Do they want to deal with it in a logical, humane way or do they want events to spin out of control whereby they do die or we get to killing each other ? Yes or No ? Never mind Overton windows, I think it’s completely irresponsible to not just tell the truth about this……as I’ve said before, we don’t have the excuse of “we don’t know” or “we didn’t have access to lots of different quality information” ……we have all that and given that we do isn’t it incumbent on us to not just blindly get behind the first lifebelt that floats past ?…..shouldn’t we be demanding the people we are lending support to are on the case in a serious way and not trying to bullshit us ? Very fair, level headed view mate…..as always, it’s not an argument, it’s a conversation Danny Kruger, a sitting Tory MP and shadow minister has just defected to Reform. I know many people will not like this, but he was to the right of the Tory Party and a Brexiteer and thinks the Tory’s don’t represent the right of British politics anymore, so I’ll accept him . Cheers. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
WILF 50,660 Posted 1 hour ago Report Share Posted 1 hour ago Just now, chartpolski said: Danny Kruger, a sitting Tory MP and shadow minister has just defected to Reform. I know many people will not like this, but he was to the right of the Tory Party and a Brexiteer and thinks the Tory’s don’t represent the right of British politics anymore, so I’ll accept him . Cheers. I would be broadly in agreement with lots of things Danny Kruger says, however, I’ve been bitten so many times (as we all have) that I’m a bit shy…..deeds and words mate, deeds and words ! So I can say I agree with him about marriage and a few other bits, but there’s also a big voice in my head saying “This bloke was part of the apparatus over the last 20 years and how did that turn out ? , he was Cameron’s speech writer and what was Cameron ?, He worked for Sunak and what was Sunak ?…….. Its a simple equation, if Himmler suddenly said “I’m a Rabbi now and I love the Jews” who would buy it ? Would anyone who did buy it be a bit naive ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
WILF 50,660 Posted 1 hour ago Report Share Posted 1 hour ago Same for Lee Anderson, a dyed in the wool Blairite and Labour member for 30 years ! The man is a traitor and I’m not buying that he is suddenly “on our side” Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chartpolski 28,163 Posted 1 hour ago Report Share Posted 1 hour ago 1 minute ago, WILF said: Its a simple equation, if Himmler suddenly said “I’m a Rabbi now and I love the Jews” who would buy it ? Would anyone who did buy it be a bit naive ? Kruger isn’t saying “I agree with Stalin, I’m going to become a communist” ! LOL ! He’s moving to a party that he thinks more represents his views, and leaving a party that has rejected his and the Tory’s historical views. I know your not calling me “naive”, I’m more hopeful than naive, in thinking he is doing the right thing, but I will always be sceptical of ALL politicians, some more than others. As the old Chinese saying goes; “we live in interesting times” ! Cheers. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chartpolski 28,163 Posted 1 hour ago Report Share Posted 1 hour ago 1 minute ago, WILF said: Same for Lee Anderson, a dyed in the wool Blairite and Labour member for 30 years ! The man is a traitor and I’m not buying that he is suddenly “on our side” My own brother worked for 45 years for the local Labour Council, a union convener and H&S manager and a card carrying Labour Party member. His “Road to Damascus “ moment came as he realised today’s Labour Party isn’t the same party he has supported all his life , and he tore up his membership card and left the party. So, to use another metaphor; “ leopards CAN change their spots” ! Cheers. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Borr 8,037 Posted 1 hour ago Report Share Posted 1 hour ago 12 minutes ago, chartpolski said: My own brother worked for 45 years for the local Labour Council, a union convener and H&S manager and a card carrying Labour Party member. His “Road to Damascus “ moment came as he realised today’s Labour Party isn’t the same party he has supported all his life , and he tore up his membership card and left the party. So, to use another metaphor; “ leopards CAN change their spots” ! Cheers. Has he joined corbyns 'new party' lol Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mackay 3,661 Posted 38 minutes ago Report Share Posted 38 minutes ago 1 hour ago, chartpolski said: Danny Kruger, a sitting Tory MP and shadow minister has just defected to Reform. I know many people will not like this, but he was to the right of the Tory Party and a Brexiteer and thinks the Tory’s don’t represent the right of British politics anymore, so I’ll accept him . Cheers. At least he was a sitting mp, I've got a bit of respect for him. The others?, they have nothing to lose. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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