Rural organisations call on House of Lords to support hare poaching amendment

[Born Hunter 17,910]

39 minutes ago, WILF said:

Don’t matter what you do or how you go about it, you will never convince your ordinary every day citizen that a sweet looking roe doe with a lurcher clamped to its neck is in anyway acceptable……it’s a battle you can never win.

So don’t try to win it…….good on the lads that say “f**k it” and just get on with zero fucks given, old duffers like me who are way too comfy in our armchair and don’t need the ag ain’t the future of dogs, lads killing stuff are.

In this instance it ain’t upsetting joe blogs that’s the problem, it’s farmer Giles.

There are lads out there digging 3-400 a season without provoking the farming and land owning community to back campaigns to increase policing and punishments. Coursing said ‘f**k it’ and yeah fair whatever that’s their choice given their circumstances but it was THEIR choice. 

[WILF 50,239]

49 minutes ago, Born Hunter said:

In this instance it ain’t upsetting joe blogs that’s the problem, it’s farmer Giles.

There are lads out there digging 3-400 a season without provoking the farming and land owning community to back campaigns to increase policing and punishments. Coursing said ‘f**k it’ and yeah fair whatever that’s their choice given their circumstances but it was THEIR choice. 

They will close all the loop holes eventually, like coursing they will make it an offence for the farmer to allow lads on and hey presto, most of the permission will disappear over night.

It may well even be an offence now but if anyone thinks acting the gent for any reason other than that’s just how you like to conduct yourself will make a difference then I reckon they are very wide of the mark.

Shooting like yours will be ok for a good while because it’s pretty solitary and in many cases highly monetised.

[Gypsydog94 4,705]

1 hour ago, WILF said:

They will close all the loop holes eventually, like coursing they will make it an offence for the farmer to allow lads on and hey presto, most of the permission will disappear over night.

It may well even be an offence now but if anyone thinks acting the gent for any reason other than that’s just how you like to conduct yourself will make a difference then I reckon they are very wide of the mark.

Shooting like yours will be ok for a good while because it’s pretty solitary and in many cases highly monetised.

Antis have been having a good go at shooting this season. You watch laws change to protect the money men

[shaaark 11,427]

3 hours ago, tatsblisters said:

social media has had a big impact on how ordinary joe public view lad's coursing a few hares. 

Was indeed the beginning of the end, not just of coursing. 

[South hams hunter 8,988]

44 minutes ago, Gypsydog94 said:

Antis have been having a good go at shooting this season. You watch laws change to protect the money men

they already have started on that with the new trespass laws

[tatsblisters 10,960]

9 minutes ago, shaaark said:

Was indeed the beginning of the end, not just of coursing. 

Ain't that the truth. I remember years ago all you would get would be the odd clip on country file about illegal hare coursing nowadays its made out by some media outlets as worse than murder. 

[Gypsydog94 4,705]

6 minutes ago, South hams hunter said:

they already have started on that with the new trespass laws

What’s the likelihood of them coming in with Carrie pulling on Bojos reigns? 

[South hams hunter 8,988]

6 minutes ago, Gypsydog94 said:

What’s the likelihood of them coming in with Carrie pulling on Bojos reigns? 

pass 

[Born Hunter 17,910]

2 hours ago, WILF said:

They will close all the loop holes eventually, like coursing they will make it an offence for the farmer to allow lads on and hey presto, most of the permission will disappear over night.

It may well even be an offence now but if anyone thinks acting the gent for any reason other than that’s just how you like to conduct yourself will make a difference then I reckon they are very wide of the mark.

Shooting like yours will be ok for a good while because it’s pretty solitary and in many cases highly monetised.

It was indeed written into the ‘05 act as an offence for landowners to allow illegal hunting. But yeah sure loopholes get closed, primarily as a result of total public idiocy, like those hero pikies rallying and like the masters holding a f***ing ‘how we break the law’ digital workshop.

I disagree with the sentiment of the gentlemanly comment. I think presentation in life is everything. But there’s no point in us going around on this.

Ill always being killing something because I’m not pigeon holed. I’m not a hunting man, I’m not a dog man, I’m not a shooting man etc etc. There’s too much to do to just do one. I’m as happy shooting woodcock over a spaniel on my own as I am taking part in a 300 bird day. The end of everything is beyond my sporting life. Nonetheless I don’t want to see any of it gone.

[WILF 50,239]

1 minute ago, Born Hunter said:

It was indeed written into the ‘05 act as an offence for landowners to allow illegal hunting. But yeah sure loopholes get closed, primarily as a result of total public idiocy, like those hero pikies rallying and like the masters holding a f***ing ‘how we break the law’ digital workshop.

Point is, there’s nothing left to loose so whatever anyone does makes very little difference really to the majority of lurcher owners…..that ship has sailed so they make as well do as they please if you get my drift 

1 minute ago, Born Hunter said:

I disagree with the sentiment of the gentlemanly comment. I think presentation in life is everything. But there’s no point in us going around on this.

I genuinely wasn’t being sarcastic with that comment mate, I like to crack on like that myself but my point was if we think just that fact will save anything then I don’t think it will.

1 minute ago, Born Hunter said:

Ill always being killing something because I’m not pigeon holed. I’m not a hunting man, I’m not a dog man, I’m not a shooting man etc etc. There’s too much to do to just do one. I’m as happy shooting woodcock over a spaniel on my own as I am taking part in a 300 bird day. The end of everything is beyond my sporting life. Nonetheless I don’t want to see any of it gone.

Anything earning money and not making a loud noise (yeah, I know! Lol) will last a lot longer than anything else was my point mate.

[Born Hunter 17,910]

32 minutes ago, WILF said:

Point is, there’s nothing left to loose so whatever anyone does makes very little difference really to the majority of lurcher owners…..that ship has sailed so they make as well do as they please if you get my drift 

Maybe we have been speaking at cross purposes here. I don’t disagree with that. I’ve simply been pointing out why coursing has found itself the enemy of the rest of the countryside and this sort of anti coursing movement has risen.

For over a decade I was involved with a DIY syndicate shoot in coursing country. Out that way the type of shoots that dominate are little piss pot syndicates because the land is shit, put simply. Yeah there’s commercial stuff but it’s not the mainstay. We were on 1700 acres and rent was like 3.5k. There was a well known fella from up the A1 that was allowed to run his dogs on there but he was tolerated more than welcomed imo. You reckon that attitude might’ve changed if 3k rent was paid each year for the coursing? 4-5 lads who play the game and have a touch of brainpower with guns and a shot hare in the bag having a rough shoot with their repurposed lurchers… I can categorically tell you out that way with that attitude no one would’ve given a f**k. There was another way but the majority would rather be ripping up the winter wheat and then winge that the rest of the countryside f****d them. And that’s why you get unmarked astras patrolling country lanes with uniformed plod inside pulling anyone with muddy boots. It’s not the coursing that’s the problem, it’s the way coursing chose to operate post ban.

Im not judging coursing for going that way. I don’t give a f**k really but it’s just a little much listening to the wingeing for me. They chose to be outlaws, so own it! Which in actual fact I respect you for doing.

Edited December 14, 2021 by Born Hunter

[South hams hunter 8,988]

2 minutes ago, Born Hunter said:

Maybe we have been speaking at cross purposes here. I don’t disagree with that. I’ve simply been pointing out why coursing has found itself the enemy of the rest of the countryside and this sort of anti coursing movement has risen.

For over a decade I was involved with a DIY syndicate shoot in coursing country. Out that way the type of shoots that dominate are little piss pot syndicates because the land is shit, put simply. Yeah there’s commercial stuff but it’s not the mainstay. We were on 1700 acres and rent was like 3.5k. There was a well known fella from up the A1 that was allowed to run his dogs on there but he was tolerated more than welcomed imo. You reckon that attitude might’ve changed if 3k rent was paid each year for the coursing? 4-5 lads with guns and a shot hare in the bag having a rough shoot with their repurposed lurchers who play the game and have a touch of brainpower… I can categorically tell you out that way with that attitude no one would’ve given a f**k. There was another way but the majority would rather be ripping up the winter wheat and then winge that the rest of the countryside f****d them. And that’s why you get unmarked astras patrolling country lanes with uniformed plod inside pulling anyone with muddy boots. It’s not the coursing that’s the problem, it’s the way coursing chose to operate post ban.

Im not judging coursing for going that way. I don’t give a f**k really but it’s just a little much listening to the wingeing for me. They chose to be outlaws, so own it! Which in actual fact I respect you for doing.

when the ban came in a friend of mine said 'if you outlaw hunting then outlaws will go hunting' and that is what it often looks like 

[Born Hunter 17,910]

1 minute ago, South hams hunter said:

when the ban came in a friend of mine said 'if you outlaw hunting then outlaws will go hunting' and that is what it often looks like 

Problem coursing had is to be the outlaw you make yourself a c**t to powerful stakeholders in the countryside.

Shooting has economic and political clout to leverage. Hunting has enormous political tools, there’s hunting men in every corner of the establishment from councillors to PMs, from police wildlife crime officers to directors of intelligence services. Farming obviously has great economic power too.

Now I’m not suggesting these make hunting and shooting etc bulletproof but when compared to coursing, what does that have to leverage when deciding to operate the way they do?

Its f***ing wrong the way it’s all gone.

[South hams hunter 8,988]

10 minutes ago, Born Hunter said:

Problem coursing had is to be the outlaw you make yourself a c**t to powerful stakeholders in the countryside.

Shooting has economic and political clout to leverage. Hunting has enormous political tools, there’s hunting men in every corner of the establishment from councillors to PMs, from police wildlife crime officers to directors of intelligence services. Farming obviously has great economic power too.

Now I’m not suggesting these make hunting and shooting etc bulletproof but when compared to coursing, what does that have to leverage when deciding to operate the way they do?

Its f***ing wrong the way it’s all gone.

Exactly they have no eligibility to stakes because there is no economic benefit to coursing; especially when the people coursing are doing more damage than they would ever pay in rent. 

The other part in relation to you saying about hunting men from mps to police; would they ever be silly enough to associate with a practise that is not only seen as cruel by antis but the general public? Realistically I don't think so, fox hunting has the Vale of scent hunting but there isn't one you can give to coursing hares. There is no 'non cruel' and realistic alternative imo. 

[Born Hunter 17,910]

Just now, South hams hunter said:

Exactly they have no eligibility to stakes because there is no economic benefit to coursing; especially when the people coursing are doing more damage than they would ever pay in rent. 

The other part in relation to you saying about hunting men from mps to police; would they ever be silly enough to associate with a practise that is not only seen as cruel by antis but the general public? Realistically I don't think so, fox hunting has the Vale of scent hunting but there isn't one you can give to coursing hares. There is no 'non cruel' and realistic alternative imo. 

That’s why I suggest small casual groups operating under the guise of rough shooting and paying rent to make themselves a valued asset to the countryside. The antis wouldn’t be chasing such small informal groups. Hunts are too in your face to avoid them but they survive because they are trail hunting, right, lol. Legitimate coursing could have survived simply by making themselves valuable and operating with a bit of savvy imo.

But it was never going to happen so probably ain’t worth even discussing in hindsight.