Sea Eagles Nest ... Was It You Lab ???

[Lab 10,979]

 

as far as i can see its a good old thl debate........no one has got nasty and end of the day id rather one thread like this than a load of shite ones about muslims lol......at least we are talking about stuff in the countryside than towns for once

 

In fairness, I called baw a daft twat. I didn't mean it maliciously but it was out of order and I'll apologise now.

 

I still think he's a daft twat mind but I should'nt have said it.

 

Wouldnt worry to much mate...i called him an arsehole earlier on and he agreed with me..... i probably reminded him of his ex wife..

[Wildling 520]

I'm still none the wiser of who this " Bop " bloke is.........

[Astanley 11,634]

Fek it , lets all get baw , the JR Ewing of the hunting life .

[Ratreeper 441]

 

 

 

Also, yes without game shoots a lot of woodlands and countryside would be lost. But how can you argue on one hand it is a good thing to preserve the countryside but then advocate persecuting the animals that live there? or is it only good to preserve the countryside to let non-indigenous species get shot there?

Do you know that the 'countryside' as we see it isn't a natural environment? It's the way it is because of centuries of human management, we've been preserving it as it is for a very long time..

..and I suspect many members on here have been out persecuting the animals that live there many a time, I know I have have.. You could almost say they've been hunted...

Yes we have to manage it because we have already f****d it up, how is that or hunting relevant to persecuting endangered species?

What would you suggest we do, retreat to the caves, let the forests retake all the farmland and have the place repopulated by wolves, bears and elephants like some deluded f****r was on about on radio 2 the other day?

 

We are as much a part of nature as any other animal.. Countless other species will manipulate the environment around them to make it more suitable for them to survive and thrive, it's just we do it on a far greater scale..

 

 

Well personally I would just want there to be less f***ing human beings If we could be a position where we don't need to build more houses and just be realistic about how clever we are when messing around with ecosystems then that would be a step in the right direction.

 

More specifically, I think if you have a pair of goshawks or other BOP on your shoot you should try and do what you can to keep them away from poults. But when you release something into the countryside you have to expect some losses, by everything mentioned before. now if this means you lose 25% of your stock then it means next year you will have to release 25% more and if that just isn't sustainable as a business then you fall into the category of 'tough shit' to be honest. It just isn't reasonable to release such a stupid helpless bird around predators and not expect them to take advantage, maybe people could shoot released pigeons instead or something that isn't such a fat, slow, cretinous creature that is asking for trouble. I think in the majority of cases they could still make a living but would lose profits, which is kind of similar to dumping waste on a nature reserve to save money even if it does save a few quid, saving a bit doesn't justify damaging our countryside even if the dump site is surrounded by trees that would normally have been cut down.

 

This is a classic thl thread though, I just can't help myself arguing on here I wish I had met a few more people who could vouch I am not actually a grumpy serious wanker

[Ratreeper 441]

 

 

 

 

Ratreeper stop being so f*****g ignorant! The examples you gave are miles away from releasing pheasants! Just because people want the right to control birds of prey doesn't mean the populations are gonna suffer in anyway.

 

The game shooting industry does more for british fauna than you bitching twitchers do.

 

Why are they miles away? If you want an example of a suffering population, I looked it up and as of August last year there were 67 breeding pairs of sea eagles which means if one pair is wiped out, meaning it could just be one bird killed that couldn't find a partner that equals about 1.5% of the entire UK population. In terms of genetic diversity that is catastrophic, what would you think is the right number to be given permission by pheasant shooters to exist?

 

There are also 140,000 red squirrels left in the UK, so should be wait until there are less than 67 pairs before wondering they might need a bit of help?

 

But like I said in another thread, there are a dickload of buzzards and if they need thinning out a bit then fair enough, but some losses need to be factored in for predation just like ones killed by cars, poached or wander off. To advocate making a species extinct to boost profits is incredibly selfish, which is really what you are saying if you condone the killing of sea eagles or goshawks which are on the edge.

 

 

Lets be right, the examples you were giving were ridiculously simple. You were absolutely ignorant to the benefits of keepered land. It's easy to simplify an argument to the point it looks rediculous, any half wit can do that. Releasing pheasant and partridge does f**k all damage to native fauna! Half the shit examples you were banging out would do irrevesible damage!

 

And comparing culling birds of prey to burning down competition in the market place is absurd! Culling pests and culling human competition is worlds apart.

 

Comparing red squirrel breeding pairs to sea eagle breeding pairs is again a completely flawed example. GCSE biology will teach you enough to know that a prey species like squirrels will live in much higher densities than an apex predator like a sea eagle so such a small squirrel population would be catastrophic.

 

There's a place for sea eagles in British ecology perhaps but let's not protect the shit out of them like they are some harmless bloody Pelican

 

 

How do you know how ignorant I am of anything? I have stated I can see the benefit of gameshoots, humans are selfish and without the land being of financial value as woodland it would be cut down for another fast food restaurant or for crops in a minute. But for the land to be of value, does not mean it has to be made to be the absolute highest possible financial value at the expense of everything else. You really don’t seem to see the irony of saying the shoot is good for protecting wildlife if you need to persecute the wildlife to have the shoot, you can’t have it both ways. If you want a balance then great, at the moment the scales are tipped massively towards pheasants so I assume you would like to help as many sea eagles as possible until they reach the level that prey can sustain? If you care about the countryside, shoot as many gray squirrels as you can, blast away at magpies and eradicate the mink but for fucks sake don’t start shooting the last few dregs of a species to add another couple of % gross margin to a landowners profits...Don’t try and lecture me on ecology, population or game theory.

My examples are not miles apart, swap bakery for gameshoot and tesco’s for an area with a few pairs of eagles. It is competition, whether you go to that competition or it comes to you doesn’t matter, if both you and a predator want to kill the pheasant either for survival or money and it beats you to it, I will shed a little tear when it’s survival as a species costs you a bit of margin..my heart really will bleed and I will gratefully inform my future children that everyone sat by and let yet another species get wiped out by humanity, so we could enjoy shooting birds we imported for the wealthy to blast out of the sky without needing any field craft at all, with the worst survival instinct since the panda.

 

(I don't mean the wealthy part, not generalising but many shoots are well outside the means of a normal working man/woman)

 

 

You're ignorant because your examples are over simplified and not parallel at all to what we're talking about. I know that, because I read what you wrote.

 

Irony eh............. right, 21st century game shoots are hugely beneficial for our wildlife yet I believe keepers should have to legal right to cull bop that threaten that. I don;t believe they should have the right to eradicate any species just cull to protect the shoots sustainability. Where prey thrives, predators thrive.......... so culling them aint gonna threaten any species!

 

This thread had jack shit to do with shooting eagles but enevitably it went the way of bop legislation and the argument for keepers to cull them. My argument isn't just about sea eagles, it's generic for all protected raptors.

 

I take exception to this whole bullshit ignorant attitude "f**k the millionaire shooters, they just want to kill everything". It's bollocks!

 

 

We pretty much agree on most things so I don't want to argue with you, I think we just disagree about the balance between sustainable shoots and sustainable populations. I can agree buzzards could handle thinning out, but not goshawks, any eagles and I think more could be done to help kestrels and owls that don't do any harm to anyone. Badgers could do with thinning out to help other species, the whole thing is a mess really but when specific examples come up like an eagle with a few hundred to their name, they do deserve protecting and not persecuted at the expense of imported birds to be shot for fun. You could say if the shoot disappeared the woodlands would be lost, but do you really think they would bulldoze over it and build a carpark if some of the country's rarest birds call it home?

 

Fecking hell will stop there before I carry on again, let's talk about religion again that will shut me up

[Ideation 8,217]

 

 

 

 

Also, yes without game shoots a lot of woodlands and countryside would be lost. But how can you argue on one hand it is a good thing to preserve the countryside but then advocate persecuting the animals that live there? or is it only good to preserve the countryside to let non-indigenous species get shot there?

Do you know that the 'countryside' as we see it isn't a natural environment? It's the way it is because of centuries of human management, we've been preserving it as it is for a very long time..

..and I suspect many members on here have been out persecuting the animals that live there many a time, I know I have have.. You could almost say they've been hunted...

Yes we have to manage it because we have already f****d it up, how is that or hunting relevant to persecuting endangered species?

What would you suggest we do, retreat to the caves, let the forests retake all the farmland and have the place repopulated by wolves, bears and elephants like some deluded f****r was on about on radio 2 the other day?

 

We are as much a part of nature as any other animal.. Countless other species will manipulate the environment around them to make it more suitable for them to survive and thrive, it's just we do it on a far greater scale..

 

 

Well personally I would just want there to be less f*****g human beings If we could be a position where we don't need to build more houses and just be realistic about how clever we are when messing around with ecosystems then that would be a step in the right direction.

 

More specifically, I think if you have a pair of goshawks or other BOP on your shoot you should try and do what you can to keep them away from poults. But when you release something into the countryside you have to expect some losses, by everything mentioned before. now if this means you lose 25% of your stock then it means next year you will have to release 25% more and if that just isn't sustainable as a business then you fall into the category of 'tough shit' to be honest. It just isn't reasonable to release such a stupid helpless bird around predators and not expect them to take advantage, maybe people could shoot released pigeons instead or something that isn't such a fat, slow, cretinous creature that is asking for trouble. I think in the majority of cases they could still make a living but would lose profits, which is kind of similar to dumping waste on a nature reserve to save money even if it does save a few quid, saving a bit doesn't justify damaging our countryside even if the dump site is surrounded by trees that would normally have been cut down.

 

This is a classic thl thread though, I just can't help myself arguing on here I wish I had met a few more people who could vouch I am not actually a grumpy serious wanker

 

 

 

Out of interest, what if the presence and numbers of the bird of prey in question, is as a direct result of the provision of a plentiful food source, in the form of pheasant poults. If the keeper is sustaining, supporting and enlarging the population of said BOP, should he also be allowed to manage it? Because around here, they sure as feck dont eat the rabbits or hare. . . . .

[Malt 379]

 

Out of interest, what if the presence and numbers of the bird of prey in question, is as a direct result of the provision of a plentiful food source, in the form of pheasant poults. If the keeper is sustaining, supporting and enlarging the population of said BOP, should he also be allowed to manage it? Because around here, they sure as feck dont eat the rabbits or hare. . . . .

 

 

Spot on Jai.. We're always being told about some of the things we do having a negative effect on wildlife populations, but it works the other way too. Certain things we do also have the effect of making conditions more suitable for some animals and resulting in a higher population than there would naturally be. Conservation and its efforts should always work both ways IMO..

[danw 1,748]

Some keeper you!!! Your supposed to come on and explain to Stewie that he is talking pish........again!!.....Infact wait till he reads this back sober, i'm sure he'll be a tad embarrassed..........

Lol there aint no point trying to debate this as the saying goes "there's non so blind as they as just won't see" and since my point of veiw aint gonna be changed by anyone on here then other than piss takes its no worth the effort

[lanesra 4,007]

Imagine The Devestation On The BOP Population If Keepers/Land Owners Where Granted Permission To Kill BsOP They Thought Was Damaging There Sport . . There Numbers Would Tumble Over Night . . I Personally Think Any Bird Of Pray Would Be Shot On Site If Laws Allowed Those Ive Mentioned A Free Hand To Manage BsOP . . Or Should I Believe They Wouldnt Persecute Anything With A Hooked Bill In There Line Off Fire Unless They Knew It Was Affecting There Shoot ?

[Ideation 8,217]

Imagine The Devestation On The BOP Population If Keepers/Land Owners Where Granted Permission To Kill BsOP They Thought Was Damaging There Sport . . There Numbers Would Tumble Over Night . . I Personally Think Any Bird Of Pray Would Be Shot On Site If Laws Allowed Those Ive Mentioned A Free Hand To Manage BsOP . . Or Should I Believe They Wouldnt Persecute Anything With A Hooked Bill In There Line Off Fire Unless They Knew It Was Affecting There Shoot ?

 

You sound a lot like the folk at the RSPB mate. Making out all keepers have no interest in the natural world, and no understanding of balance.. . . and that all keepers would shoot any BOP on sight. It's just not true.

[Wildling 520]

 

Imagine The Devestation On The BOP Population If Keepers/Land Owners Where Granted Permission To Kill BsOP They Thought Was Damaging There Sport . . There Numbers Would Tumble Over Night . . I Personally Think Any Bird Of Pray Would Be Shot On Site If Laws Allowed Those Ive Mentioned A Free Hand To Manage BsOP . . Or Should I Believe They Wouldnt Persecute Anything With A Hooked Bill In There Line Off Fire Unless They Knew It Was Affecting There Shoot ?

 

You sound a lot like the folk at the RSPB mate. Making out all keepers have no interest in the natural world, and no understanding of balance.. . . and that all keepers would shoot any BOP on sight. It's just not true.

 

 

Unless your Lab.........

[Ideation 8,217]

 

 

Imagine The Devestation On The BOP Population If Keepers/Land Owners Where Granted Permission To Kill BsOP They Thought Was Damaging There Sport . . There Numbers Would Tumble Over Night . . I Personally Think Any Bird Of Pray Would Be Shot On Site If Laws Allowed Those Ive Mentioned A Free Hand To Manage BsOP . . Or Should I Believe They Wouldnt Persecute Anything With A Hooked Bill In There Line Off Fire Unless They Knew It Was Affecting There Shoot ?

 

You sound a lot like the folk at the RSPB mate. Making out all keepers have no interest in the natural world, and no understanding of balance.. . . and that all keepers would shoot any BOP on sight. It's just not true.

 

 

Unless your Lab.........

 

 

Labs not a keeper., . . . . he's just a pheasant farmer.

[Wildling 520]

 

 

 

Imagine The Devestation On The BOP Population If Keepers/Land Owners Where Granted Permission To Kill BsOP They Thought Was Damaging There Sport . . There Numbers Would Tumble Over Night . . I Personally Think Any Bird Of Pray Would Be Shot On Site If Laws Allowed Those Ive Mentioned A Free Hand To Manage BsOP . . Or Should I Believe They Wouldnt Persecute Anything With A Hooked Bill In There Line Off Fire Unless They Knew It Was Affecting There Shoot ?

 

You sound a lot like the folk at the RSPB mate. Making out all keepers have no interest in the natural world, and no understanding of balance.. . . and that all keepers would shoot any BOP on sight. It's just not true.

 

 

Unless your Lab.........

 

 

Labs not a keeper., . . . . he's just a pheasant farmer.

 

 

And a poor one at that if he's worried about this "Bop bloke " taking his birds......

[lanesra 4,007]

 

Imagine The Devestation On The BOP Population If Keepers/Land Owners Where Granted Permission To Kill BsOP They Thought Was Damaging There Sport . . There Numbers Would Tumble Over Night . . I Personally Think Any Bird Of Pray Would Be Shot On Site If Laws Allowed Those Ive Mentioned A Free Hand To Manage BsOP . . Or Should I Believe They Wouldnt Persecute Anything With A Hooked Bill In There Line Off Fire Unless They Knew It Was Affecting There Shoot ?

 

You sound a lot like the folk at the RSPB mate. Making out all keepers have no interest in the natural world, and no understanding of balance.. . . and that all keepers would shoot any BOP on sight. It's just not true.

Well Explain To Me How Certain Birds Became Extinct ? . . The Answer To That "PERSECUTION" When A Free Hand Was Given To Keepers/Land Owners Is What Has Me Thinking Along Them Lines . . But Feel Free To Tell Me Im Wrong Having Them Views !! . . Or Did They Just Die Out Naturally

[stewie 3,387]

 

Imagine The Devestation On The BOP Population If Keepers/Land Owners Where Granted Permission To Kill BsOP They Thought Was Damaging There Sport . . There Numbers Would Tumble Over Night . . I Personally Think Any Bird Of Pray Would Be Shot On Site If Laws Allowed Those Ive Mentioned A Free Hand To Manage BsOP . . Or Should I Believe They Wouldnt Persecute Anything With A Hooked Bill In There Line Off Fire Unless They Knew It Was Affecting There Shoot ?

 

You sound a lot like the folk at the RSPB mate. Making out all keepers have no interest in the natural world, and no understanding of balance.. . . and that all keepers would shoot any BOP on sight. It's just not true.

 

i think anyone with an oz of sense would realise it aint like that mate......... the hawks, falcons, buzzards and eagles were here long before a pheasant or partridge...........they aint the cause of the problem...........its not their fault that a few thousand easy targets suddenly appear in the vicinity is it.........

 

my real issue is when the money men come in...........kill it as it costs me money each year.............

 

also i think alot of gamekeepers aint really worth a wank nowadays and its there laziness thats to blame in the first place..........lose a few hundred birds to an animal that can be controlled but they never kept on top of them and blame the protected animals with the lame excuse of "i cant touch them"...............

 

i no of one who put 800 poults in a pen that held an active earth with a litter of fox cubs in......... you can guess the results and guess who got the blame............. all the silly twat had to do was check the earths or at least ask the local hunt to run a couple of hounds through..........