Simoman 110 Posted September 27, 2011 Report Share Posted September 27, 2011 If the emotion we call love isn,t exclusive to humans , wouldn,t that bring into question the whole theory of humans being the only animals with a soul.? Ah, but how do you define a soul? What if a man or woman have no family, dont have a relationship in there life and live a moral life, enjoy things yet never find love, are they souless? Or is a soul a persons spirit and attitude, is it defined by love? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
andyfr1968 772 Posted September 27, 2011 Report Share Posted September 27, 2011 SOUNDS LIKE YOU HAVE JUST SUBSTITUTED ONE HABIT FOR ANOTHER MATEY Well happy clappy Jesus is probably healthier for the bloke than blow, booze or a bullet in the head. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Simoman 110 Posted September 27, 2011 Report Share Posted September 27, 2011 SOUNDS LIKE YOU HAVE JUST SUBSTITUTED ONE HABIT FOR ANOTHER MATEY Well happy clappy Jesus is probably healthier for the bloke than blow, booze or a bullet in the head. Spot on............... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
asanley 1,009 Posted September 27, 2011 Report Share Posted September 27, 2011 If the emotion we call love isn,t exclusive to humans , wouldn,t that bring into question the whole theory of humans being the only animals with a soul.? Ah, but how do you define a soul? What if a man or woman have no family, dont have a relationship in there life and live a moral life, enjoy things yet never find love, are they souless? Or is a soul a persons spirit and attitude, is it defined by love? I was going to try to answer this ,then I realised I,d typed the word ..soul ..and I have absolutly no idea what it means ,I suppose I mean spirituality , but I ,m not really sure about that, I find it very easy to say there is no god , ( and I believe that ) but I would also say that if you believe in a higher power , then he exists for you , it doesn,t seem to make sense but what does nowadays. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
andyfr1968 772 Posted September 27, 2011 Report Share Posted September 27, 2011 SOUNDS LIKE YOU HAVE JUST SUBSTITUTED ONE HABIT FOR ANOTHER MATEY Well happy clappy Jesus is probably healthier for the bloke than blow, booze or a bullet in the head. Spot on............... I don't hold with organised religion at all, but if it's the catalyst that helps some folks to find their inner strength to overcome problems, then fair enough. Each to their own 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Malt 379 Posted September 27, 2011 Report Share Posted September 27, 2011 Finally the below statement you made is in many ways untrue! "I think people in less developed countries with high mortality rates would probably come to accept loss easier than us. In places like the UK, long lifetimes of settled attachment have been the norm for some time now, but would the love they felt be any weaker or stronger than ours?" you need to define what you mean by 'less developed' because in smaller tribal society, the death of the individual is far more important and has far greater resonance than in ours (unless it was princess di!). In larger scale societies with a higher mortality rate, there tends to be a stronger presense of religion, usually with an angle toward ressurection etc, as it is a way of making it easier for people to come to terms with greater numbers of deaths, i.e hindu or muslim society, same with us if you go back a long time. Religion makes it easier for us to accept stuff like people dying. But that doesn't affect level of that thing we term 'love'. P.s i just woke up so i doubt any of that makes any sense, and i'm going to cringe when i read it tomorrow. I'd agree with your view. Having read what you wrote there it makes sense that those surrounded by regular death would automatically seek to find more meaning in it. Also, they'd probably feel the need to maintain a high level of emotional attachment to their loved ones considering the relatively short time they're with them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Born Hunter 17,646 Posted September 28, 2011 Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 The issue with this love debate is it is largely based on physcology, which isnt a convensional science, its very subjective and hugely based on theory. Neuroscience is a far better way of quantifying love and proving/disproving arguments, however the brain and nervous system are such incredibly complex things that our level of science and understanding just isnt there right now to answer some of these questions that philiosophers, physicists and religious men have been asking since language became evolved enough to ask. Faith is a survival mechanism that humans developed to deal with desperate situations where they no longer have control to keep themselves level headed enough to survive and not fall apart. It is not an answer to any scientific question and science will explain everything eventually. This I have 'faith' in, lol. Just because we cant definitively and satisfactorily explain love with our current level of science does not make it supernatural or unique to humans in any way. Its a naturaly selected survival mechanism. (I fear with this statement I may have just opened a new debate on evolution/Darwin...) Of course this is all just my opinion, I cant tell anyone there isnt a god of some description but our long history of science and religion suggest to me it is highly improbable... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gnasher16 29,754 Posted September 28, 2011 Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 Personally i think its easy to write off religion when you have no reason to really give it much thought.....it was always something i could never really be bothered to look into as its usually someone we dont know banging on about it and we quickly lose interest and pass them off as a bit of a fruitcake......but when people we know start to talk about it maybe thats when we start to listen,and when they are people on our level,who share the same interests and values we do and who we would class as one of our own and not folk we cant associate with i think its then much easier to show an interest in. Im sure he wouldnt mind the ol boy......this is somebody many sports folk may know who certainly raised my interest in the whole subject..... Theres 3 parts to this if you can be bothered to listen.....i tend to believe some people are open to new things and some are not,some will show no interest in something they dont fully understand others it will urge them to want to know more. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Born Hunter 17,646 Posted September 28, 2011 Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 (edited) Personally Gnasher I was brought up to believe in a God, a Christian God, I prayed for my family and loved ones every night before bed and attended traditional Christian events. I was taught all the religious storys from the bible and the underlying meaning behind them. It has nothing to do with writing it off and not giving it a chance. It has everything to do with logic, fact and science. Dont make out people like myself to be disrespectfull uneducated louts that dismiss religion with no argument. For the last 500 years religion has moved the goal posts to fit with the ever growing facts science has thrown into the world, NEVER has science moved to acomadate religion. There is room for both, and many of our species greatest scientific minds were religious people (not so much now as in the past). Some people need faith, Im not one of them. I find it incredibly hard to live on faith, its one of my many flaws, and thats not easy for me to admit either. Some people need faith, thats good, but just because somebody doesnt doesnt make their argument against religion any less valid. Atb Edited September 28, 2011 by Born Hunter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
scothunter 12,609 Posted September 28, 2011 Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 Personally Gnasher I was brought up to believe in a God, a Christian God, I prayed for my family and loved ones every night before bed and attended traditional Christian events. I was taught all the religious storys from the bible and the unlying meaning behind them. It has nothing to do with writing it off and not giving it a chance. It has everything to do with logic, fact and science. Dont make out people like myself to be disrespectfull uneducated louts that dismiss religion with no argument. For the last 500 years religion has moved the goal posts to fit with the ever growing facts science has thrown into the world, NEVER has science moved to acomadate religion. There is room for both, and many of our species greatest scientific minds were religious people (not so much now as in the past). Some people need faith, Im not one of them. I find it incredibly hard to live on faith, its one of my many flaws, and thats not easy for me to admit either. Some people need faith, thats good, but just because somebody doesnt doesnt make their argument against religion any less valid. Atb i dont see much moving of the goal posts in the catholic religion.wasnt that long ago the current pope stated,condoms was the cause of aids spreading also science are not gonna accomodate something that there is not a shred of hard evidence in the existence of god or heaven.would make them hypocrites,and tbh science is in the business of proving things by reasoning and fact. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Born Hunter 17,646 Posted September 28, 2011 Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 i dont see much moving of the goal posts in the catholic religion.wasnt that long ago the current pope stated,condoms was the cause of aids spreading Religion is slow to embrace science, for a selfish reason.... In Physics, the church has a shit load to answer for! In the last 500 years they have had no choice but to accept the discoveries made, many of which have blown their previous explanations for the natural world to bollocks! They have changed these religious explanations more times than I care to even count. But for me the bible etc isnt religion in the true sense, to me it is faith and belief in a greater being. That is quite harmless and infact of huge benefit to many people and I dare say many of our greats achieved what they did with their faith. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
WILF 44,467 Posted September 28, 2011 Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 (edited) Thanks Gnasher, I just watched all three............loved it! That man and his brothers are no muggs and I could relate to so much of what he was saying. :thumbs: Edited September 28, 2011 by WILF Quote Link to post Share on other sites
scothunter 12,609 Posted September 28, 2011 Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 IMO all religions are in decline,and have been for a number of years.there a few reasons i think is the cause of this.The leaps and bounds that science has achieved in the lasdt few decades,also a lot are very disolusioned by the scandals of child abuse,but i would say the biggest cause is the yunger generations recently are just not interested.They see the trouble and killings all done in the name of religion.for me i cant accept something on the say so of some minister/priest/pope/archbishop whatever.there is no proof,and if were honest.there more evidence disproving the god theory than there are proving it.having said that if someone finds some kind of peace or a way to live thier live through the words of the bible,then thats up to them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
oohmydog 82 Posted September 28, 2011 Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 I have nothing but respect for a honest man ,good story gnasher Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rake aboot 4,929 Posted September 28, 2011 Report Share Posted September 28, 2011 I asked Jesus into my heart in 1974, but I did not read the Bible or do the things that the Bible would have taught me to do. Later in that same year, I started smoking cigarettes, and the following year, I started smoking marijuana. About every six months I would start to feel guilty enough to go to church, but my friends would be waiting for me and hand me beer or drugs after church and then say things like, look a beer drinking Christian. I would throw the Bible down for the next six months. As time went on I started doing more and more drugs, until I could not go one day without them. I tried for several years to quit. I tore up a hundred packs of cigarettes, and poured out gallons of beer and whiskey, but I would go and buy them again. I swore never again so many times that I did not even believe myself when I said it. After thirteen years, my life was such a mess that I took a loaded 38 and stuck it in my mouth and would have pulled the trigger, but down inside I knew if I pulled the trigger I would wake up in Hell. I thought there was nothing I could do, but I said O.K. God I will give you a try. I started visiting different churches. On November, 9th 1988 I pulled up to a church with 14 pounds of marijuana in the trunk of my car and a loaded 38 in my jacket pocket. I walked into the church and at the end of the service, I said Jesus come into my heart, and he did. I spent so much time reading the Bible and listening to Christian progams on the TV and the radio that I was learning very quickly. About three days later I opened the trunk of my car and found a carton of cigarettes, I picked them up and said, hey I don't smoke anymore. I then realized that I did not even have to quit the drugs, I just did not do them anymore. It has been over 20 years since that time and I am still free. It does not matter what color you are or what country you are from Jesus loves you and he wants to be with you forever, but he will not force you to be with him. You must make that choice for yourself. If you decide that you do not want to be with Jesus, you will still live forever because you are an eternal spirit that is living inside of a temporary body, however, you will live without light, love, peace, hope, and without any of your friends or family, and with the knowledge that Jesus had paid for your sins and that the only reason that you are in Hell is because you rejected him. Pray this prayer from your heart right now. "Jesus come into my heart and take control of my life, I believe that you are not a liar, and that you will save me, because you said in Romans chapter 10 that anyone who calls on your name will be saved so I am calling on your name and I believe that I am saved." Now go tell someone what Jesus has done for you Todd In the words of the great philosophical genius, sweary Nan, What a load of old shit ! get a grip.. anyone who belives all that crap is missing something crucial in there heed !! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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