Brits sentenced to death....

[Born Hunter 17,656]

3 minutes ago, Francie said:

 

I haven't a clue about oil sales but I know one thing,sales an profits are discussed daily I would say in there company meeting,is thst not what sales teams an big wig executives get paid for born,there not sitting round fifa 22 lol

Of course. But no one controls the entire industry. OPEC tried back in 2014 and f****d themselves. That was the first industry crash I experienced.

[Greyman 26,124]

You must be right born you put a graph up, you,ll have us all having a whip round for the poor oil company’s in a minute while blindly queuing up for your electric car, mind the collie don’t nip your heels

[Born Hunter 17,656]

1 minute ago, Greyman said:

You must be right born you put a graph up,

Which is infinity more evidence than you have provided. 

2 minutes ago, Greyman said:

you,ll have us all having a whip round for the poor oil company’s in a minute while blindly queuing up for your electric car, mind the collie don’t nip your heels

It's amazing that you think oil companies want electric vehicles.

I've never suggested offering charity or sympathy. It's you lot that seem to want sympathy now the shoe is on the other foot.

[Greyman 26,124]

16 minutes ago, Born Hunter said:

Which is infinity more evidence than you have provided. 

It's amazing that you think oil companies want electric vehicles.

I've never suggested offering charity or sympathy. It's you lot that seem to want sympathy now the shoe is on the other foot.

Not really mate I drive a company vehicle and have a company fuel card so it bothers me not a jot but I can still see we’re it is all going without someone giving me an a4 piece of paper covered in charts and graphs leading me to have sympathy for the very people that are a part of the problem and drew the graphs these big company’s are all just part of the same machine that drive and control us, but hey you gotta believe what you believe and even though they differ it’s good to have views and opinions or we would all just get swept along blindly, now you have a god day while I go and fire up my 6litre John deer

[Born Hunter 17,656]

1 minute ago, Greyman said:

Not really mate I drive a company vehicle and have a company fuel card so it bothers me not a jot but I can still see we’re it is all going without someone giving me an a4 piece of paper covered in charts and graphs leading me to have sympathy for the very people that are a part of the problem and drew the graphs these big company’s are all just part of the same machine that drive and control us, but hey you gotta believe what you believe and even though they differ it’s good to have views and opinions or we would all just get swept along blindly, now you have a god day while I go and fire up my 6litre John deer

You can see can you. You can't show the rest of us, but you can see...

If someone claims that the oil companies were making great profits the past few years, how exactly do you expect to prove or disprove that without some sort of data that shows the profits?

There's a common opinion now that oil companies are f***ing the little man. No one wants to show a scrap of evidence as to how that is happening and when I offer an alternative, with evidence, born of over a decade of experience, I'm the one who's got my head in the sand?

[Greyman 26,124]

3 minutes ago, Born Hunter said:

You can see can you. You can't show the rest of us, but you can see...

If someone claims that the oil companies were making great profits the past few years, how exactly do you expect to prove or disprove that without some sort of data that shows the profits?

There's a common opinion now that oil companies are f***ing the little man. No one wants to show a scrap of evidence as to how that is happening and when I offer an alternative, with evidence, born of over a decade of experience, I'm the one who's got my head in the sand?

No mate you just have your beliefs and I have mine, your an academic so you need a paper trail to support those beliefs I,m just an old sceptic that’s been around long enough to work it out for myself, now go and enjoy your day and stop getting worked up over my lack of evidence, one last unsupported little hunch I have is the poor oil company’s will be investing heavily in wind and solar to offset there losses and continue there profits and control when we all move from diesel to electric cars, just like the tobacco industry moved into the vape market as the fag market dries up, it’s not conspiracy it’s just seeing the bigger picture  

[chartpolski 20,779]

Just trying to simplify it here;

The price of crude oil has been at this level, or higher, in the past, but the price of diesel/petrol has never been anywhere near as this high........Why ?

Cheers.

[Born Hunter 17,656]

1 minute ago, Greyman said:

No mate you just have your beliefs and I have mine, your an academic so you need a paper trail to support those beliefs I,m just an old sceptic that’s been around long enough to work it out for myself, now go and enjoy your day and stop getting worked up over my lack of evidence

Surely everyone needs evidence to follow a belief? Or can anyone just claim anything and everyone is expected to follow blindly?

6 minutes ago, Greyman said:

one last unsupported little hunch I have is the poor oil company’s will be investing heavily in wind and solar to offset there losses and continue there profits and control when we all move from diesel to electric cars, just like the tobacco industry moved into the vape market as the fag market dries up, it’s not conspiracy it’s just seeing the bigger picture  

It's not unsupported, it's happening. The exec's and VPs of oil companies aren't wedded to oil, they're wedded to profitability, which is still 90% in oil. Politicians and the politically active public have made it clear that oil is the enemy and will be killed off as soon as the tech allows. Oil companies have been diversifying their operations and investments for some time, in preparation for the time that that shift comes. They didn't want to have to do that, it's a response to unpredictable markets, markets they don't have control over.

[Born Hunter 17,656]

3 minutes ago, chartpolski said:

Just trying to simplify it here;

The price of crude oil has been at this level, or higher, in the past, but the price of diesel/petrol has never been anywhere near as this high........Why ?

Cheers.

Processing costs? Inflation driving up the cost of processing the crude into petro' products.

Only like 30% (need to check the exact figure!) of what we pay at the pump for petrol/diesel is the cost of getting the crude out of the ground right? The rest is processing and tax. A lot of tax.

[chartpolski 20,779]

1 minute ago, Born Hunter said:

Processing costs? Inflation driving up the cost of processing the crude into petro' products.

Only like 30% (need to check the exact figure!) of what we pay at the pump for petrol/diesel is the cost of getting the crude out of the ground right? The rest is processing and tax. A lot of tax.

And the petrol retailers profiteering?

Also the fact we shut down all or most of our refineries and import already refined products?

Plus the "net zero" factor.

Remember the wholly manufactured "fuel shortage" of a few months ago, when a government spokesman "accidentally" let slip concerns of a shortage, later blamed on a shortage of HGV drivers ?

Queues around the block, petrol stations running dry, prices going up and the perfect opportunity for the government to slip in E10 fuel, more expensive and less MPG !

Did we suddenly find more HGV drives ? Of course not ! We've got LESS, due to the huge backlog in HGT testing and lisence renewals.

Also, as you mention, the huge tax burden on fuel, the highest in the world ?

Cheers.

[Born Hunter 17,656]

2 minutes ago, chartpolski said:

And the petrol retailers profiteering?

If they are then I don't know what they were making before, given their margins are like 1-2p/lt.

The greatest cost is extracting and processing.

[dogmandont 9,428]

1 minute ago, Born Hunter said:

If they are then I don't know what they were making before, given their margins are like 1-2p/lt.

The greatest cost is extracting and processing.

So is it higher fuel costs that is pushing up the cost of extraction and transporting fuel? 

[Born Hunter 17,656]

9 minutes ago, chartpolski said:

Remember the wholly manufactured "fuel shortage" of a few months ago, when a government spokesman "accidentally" let slip concerns of a shortage, later blamed on a shortage of HGV drivers ?

Queues around the block, petrol stations running dry, prices going up and the perfect opportunity for the government to slip in E10 fuel, more expensive and less MPG !

Did we suddenly find more HGV drives ? Of course not ! We've got LESS, due to the huge backlog in HGT testing and lisence renewals.

As you say there never was a shortage. As I kept saying at the time. It was entirely spontaneous panic and led to the forecourts being quiet shortly after due to all the 'five quid a week mob' having full tanks and not needing it.

[Borr 4,604]

11 hours ago, Born Hunter said:

Remind me how the oil industry was bailed out by the tax payer? I’m not interested in any other industry, we’re talking about oil.

What foresight? What should they have done to prepare for a downturn? How can a company expect to continue to exist when they are making a loss? How can they Mai Tain their current OpEx and staff levels when they are making a loss because of a market crash in demand?

 Lack of storage facilities especially gas, shutting North sea down, paying off loads of skilled blokes and losing them to other industries, investing in russian interests against British and American advice. You're obviously a loyal company man, I'm sure you'll do well (pun). Didn't they comment they were printing money and didn't know what to do with it , some announced profits of ten billion no? I might have been thinking of Scottish power asking the government to loan us all a grand so they get paid and we all get a debt

[Born Hunter 17,656]

Just now, dogmandont said:

So is it higher fuel costs that is pushing up the cost of extraction and transporting fuel? 

That won't do it alone, it'd be like perpetual motion if it was. 

The highest crude has ever been was a spike in 2008. Which corresponded with diesel at like 1.30/lt. The crude price was a little higher than it is currently but clearly the diesel price is much different. Bare in mind that inflation roughly halves the value of the pound every 20-30 years. 2008 was 14 years ago, so the cost to do anything with the crude back then would've been a fair bit cheaper.

Forecourt retailers are literally making like 1p per lt. It's such a competitive market, if they try to profiteer then their competitors will undercut them and we will all drain their pumps, leaving the profiteers with full pump and empty accounts!

To profiteer requires either a monopoly on the supply or cooperation with all other suppliers/retailers. OPEC are a cooperative group of oil companies that together have a significant chunk of the supply and have tried to manipulate oil prices to their advantage. At times they have been successful but it never lasts, one member will end up selling more than they agreed to to capitalise on their manipulated price and it all collapses or like in 2014 when OPEC tried to put the US out of businesses by flooding the market with cheap oil, the yanks were more resilient than they expected and it f****d OPEC. Well it f****d everyone actually. 

Stuff like that always goes on but this is entirely down to a covid induced downturn, where the companies massively cut their operations to get in line with covid era demand. But the world came out of covid more quickly than the industry could rebuild it's ops to meet the demand. In business it's always quicker to cut than build! To rapidly build requires risky levels of debt to just buy up small companies to make yours bigger. A. that doesn't improve the entire industries ability to supply, just the org' that is buying, B. it's risky as f**k taking on that debt if the market collapses again. I have very real experience of that sort of strategy!