Tongs

[fish 148]

well iv read all the posts so far.quiet a lot has been said.against them i think a lot of your posts would say different if it was aloud by law in your country.we can BY LAW here use them and find them very handy at times.less suffering for the terrier and game.

[neil cooney 10,415]

Nick,

IMO there are 3 ways a dig should finish up and the first one is if the quarry is to be killed then a firearm should be used. If the quarry is to be let run for another day then stand out of the way and let it run. If it refuses to run then you get in there and take him out with your paws.

IMO a tongs, lurcher or strongdog is messy. And I've used all 3 in the past.

If testing a strongdog is the idea, then this is not the way.

JMHO.

If your afraid of the heat, stay outta the kitchen.

ever get bit neil?

Yes Sounder, I've been bitten on the hands 5 or 6 times.

[neil cooney 10,415]

Neil you have to differnciate between a strong dog and a game dog.A strong dog was used for the purpose of working in the field,wheatens/glens/kerry blues(I just threw them in for the laugh )were never meant for anything else than field work/farm work/vermin destruction.I would not consider using a lurcher at the end of a dig UNLESS the quarry were to be killed,the damage they do to the quarry is extensive and since we let everything we dig run on unless requested to do so we dont have use for such a dog.I did have one many years ago but decided it was not for me.What the hell is messy with a tongs,it grips the animal about its neck area and with a tug hes out,like a cork out of a bottle,then the ould fellas told me they tailed him and released the quarry in any place they wanted to.Tongs were used Im told long before the trials were about.I worked a bull bitch for many a year ,I SIR AM NOT A COWARD ANNOYING .....YES (so ive been told).Your dancing days are at a standstill Neill I see,lol.You do seem to draw your own conclusions to matters and fail to see others perspectives on issues.If we all looked on things as you do then the working heavy dog would be a thing of the past,wheatens,and glens would be nothing more that show shite,what would a lot of the wheaten/greyhound lurcher fans do,I would think when badgrs were game ball to dig a tongs would have had its uses in the field,fast,controlled and virtually painless but we'll just have to guess now,LIam Delaney you have me sussed I can never show my face in a green field again.

Jigsaw, I wont argue with anything you've said and I agree with nearly all. However ,I do think that the true strongdog would be better of if 90% of the lads who have them got rid of them. 10 years ago only a handful of lads had them and used them, but, they were good ones because they were in the hands of proper dog men.

Nowadays they're a money spinner, JMHO.

[neil cooney 10,415]

over the years ive met many a man that used tongs and none of them were COWARDS,they know more about dogs and working them than most.Neil I find that statement of yours rather silly and condesending.you obviously have a very high opinion of yourself..These proper dog men could handle any quarry with their hands.Tongs I was told could remove the quarry cleanly and quickly and with little harm to it.What about the people long ago that kept draw dogs,wheatens/staffs etc,these were equivilent to a tongs.The difference being you didnt have to feed,walk or clean after the metal ones.I suppose the owners of heavy dogs were cowards too?

No Jigsaw the owners of strongdogs were just that, the owners of strongdogs.

Anyone who keeps strongdogs and thinks that the end of a dig is the way to work them is fooling themselves. If a strongdog is needed practicaly at the end of a dig then you must question how good is the terrier you've just dug to.

Think about it ? What was a tongs for ? It was for holding an animal at the end of a dig so that the handler wouldn't be bitten. Simple as that. There's no other answer.

Use a terrier that gets you close to your quarry and learn how to handle it.

No dissrespect to any old timer, they knew no better. Time to move on.

If a strongdog is needed practicaly at the end of a dig then you must question how good is the terrier you've just dug to...................you said you have used strong dogs before neill so did you question how good the terriers you were digging to were?????????

No Scent, I've been lucky enough to have (usually) kept myself in the company of good terriers. The reason we used to use a strong dog or tongs at the end was because that was the way I was shown as a young lad.

As I got older and more experienced ( or inexperienced) I learned and made up my own mind as to what is practicle, cruel and bullshit.

The way we end our digs nowadays IMO is the handiest, most humane and professional(not that I'm paid).

[neil cooney 10,415]

Lads it's been fun debating this issue but I'll end now as it might look like I'm insulting the strongdog and our old timers in the terrier game.

I'm not.

But what I will say is this,

The use of strongdogs, lurchers and contraptions like tongs leave themselves way open to abuse of our quarry (I've seen terriers removed with tongs too) but going in there with your hands is more humane and professional.

Take care.

[Nick 14]

well iv read all the posts so far.quiet a lot has been said.against them i think a lot of your posts would say different if it was aloud by law in your country.we can BY LAW here use them and find them very handy at times.less suffering for the terrier and game.

Sir as a student of this technic can I ask you, to verify the claims of several people here, whats your sexual preference?

 

 

 

 

 

 

LOL sorry mate, couldn't resist the joke

No bad intentions meant. Just blame it on the fact that I am Dutch and have the wrong friends(you know some )

[fish 148]

:

well iv read all the posts so far.quiet a lot has been said.against them i think a lot of your posts would say different if it was aloud by law in your country.we can BY LAW here use them and find them very handy at times.less suffering for the terrier and game.

Sir as a student of this technic can I ask you, to verify the claims of several people here, whats your sexual preference?

lol lol I'm coming your way hunting in a week or 2 perhaps we can meet.

 

 

 

 

 

LOL sorry mate, couldn't resist the joke

No bad intentions meant. Just blame it on the fact that I am Dutch and have the wrong friends(you know some )

[liamdelaney 2,586]

Only when Im trying it on in bed with her,LIAM Anyone thats at this game should be well capable of handeling their quarry at the end of a dig,but saying that,the tongs must have been handy to have just in case it was needed.

 

They were handy for threatning the wild life ranger as he looked in from the next field.

[Waz 4,224]

Some of the wildlife rangers round here get me the odd digging permission.

[fionn 21]

neil get back to work and out hunting i think uv too much time on ur hands didnt a little dublin lad tell us that he bang you on the back of the head one time with a set of tongs. :11: hes was well known for telling the odd lie

[tearem 31]

I have a set of tongs like all other tools. It is not forbidden here.

But I would use them more to put logs in the fire, if I had a fireplace.

They are at hand ready for use, they may come in if the quarry is just out of reach under a boulder or so, I use the tongs maybe once a year. Mostly, I either tail the quarry and lift it out and take it from the sett to be shot, (in sand, they otherwise dig themselves in right away instead of presenting) I try to make him bolt for the Guns, or after we have opened and removed the terrier, a Gun shoots it, as in Germany this sort of digging is control, not mere sport.

There are too many of these beasts in certain places (especially small game hunts) and that's why we dig them.

Of course you need a terrier, or a number of terriers if you have more places to dig, a dog which can do the job.

They are quite a challenge and more difficult than the wild boar above ground because the boar are easier to avoid when they come, both these formidable animals require a clever terrier. The terrier must go twice the weight uphill, so no chance by contact.

I don't have a drawing dog, never needed one. If I can't control the situation at the end of a dig I am not a real terrier woman. I had a Glen and she could do it, tested her once in practice and then sold her to some other terrier fanciers.

I've been bitten by fox some 3 times and handled about 50 alive afterwards. I also put down (with the knife) about 20 wild boar annually which my dogs have caught. Other boar hunters with dogs do that too in these circumstances, although in Germany they are allowed to shoot, in the Ardennes they are not. You cannot shoot safely when one or more dogs are on the quarry. On the other hand, sometimes you MUST have a gun and shoot. Like when trailing wounded big game and the leashed dog finds the boar or stag and it is up and running again.

[liamdelaney 2,586]

Some of the wildlife rangers round here get me the odd digging permission.

 

The only thing they ever tried to get me was jail.

[neil cooney 10,415]

neil get back to work and out hunting i think uv too much time on ur hands didnt a little dublin lad tell us that he bang you on the back of the head one time with a set of tongs. :11: hes was well known for telling the odd lie

LMAO Fionn I forgot all about that story, I still have the scar from those tongs.

See I told you they can really be mis-used. Classic.

[joe bloggs 0]

neil get back to work and out hunting i think uv too much time on ur hands didnt a little dublin lad tell us that he bang you on the back of the head one time with a set of tongs. :11: hes was well known for telling the odd lie

LMAO Fionn I forgot all about that story, I still have the scar from those tongs.

See I told you they can really be mis-used. Classic.

Reading with Great interest,Mr cooney's speeches about heavy dogs and trials and tongs. Over the last 30 years and a bit i have been to many a trial and never seen Tongs used.But anyway have you ever been to a Federation trial,oh i don't know your age so maybe your to young to understand how the federation worked,and Have youever heard of a DOG called HECKELTOWN JACK. OR a Wheaton Bitch called CLEO :whistling:

Edited January 24, 2011 by joe bloggs

[fat man 4,740]

Ithink the dog was called hacketstown jack maybe wrong