Too Fast..possible or not,

[inan 841]

only one way to make them think for them selves and slow down ,let them run of the lead ,as soon as you can take them out with other dogs when they are young ,if you just keep sliping them of a lead ,they only learn to run flat out .

All my dogs are running free as soon as they can keep up with the older dogs,I beleive some dogs learn to run cunning and some don't ,and I have seen a few hundred working to make this assessment.

[inan 841]

thank you dan 2GOOD you stand corrected

disagree ,you say dogs cant learn to be clever \i say they can ,and run how you teach them

How do you TEACH a dog to run [bANNED TEXT] a dogs running game its only under its own control and its style of running imho will mainly be down to its breeding.

i will tell you ,from day one when i run my dogs ,if they go flat out up the beam and i dont want them doing it ,i turn the lamp of ,after a few outing they learn to stop when its not on ,so the first step is done ,then its just a matter of of and on untill it gets to where i want him \ie near the chosen quary ,after a season they will run steady ,or if i give them a PSSS,they will quicken if needed,when my dogs have had 2 seasons i can even show them a rabbit or what ever in the beam ,and send them in the dark with the odd flick every now and then,to it,never mind how far,that is how you teach a dog to run how you want it to ,but i am a bit clever when it comes to training a dog to lamp . : o and i can also call the dog of if i want ,so it just proves i have taught it to run or not .nothing to do with breeding .

No ,it just proves what you say, may apply to lamping.What about daytime?

[chartpolski 26,558]

to see them on the fens, doing 2-3 minute courses, (which is actualy a long time for a course), is like watching paint dry

 

 

I feel the exact same way. I am not knockin them. If thats what you like then so be it but I want it fast as can be.

 

Dan, there's been people on here said their dog had a 20 minute run, (!!!!), on a fox; Christ, I would have went to the pub and had a couple of pints, then came back to see the end of the course ! The real coursing lads timed the courses, and a 2-3 minute would be classed as a "grueller" !

 

Cheers. JUST AS I THOUGHT SAT IN THE PUB TALKING ABOUT IT,WE CALL THEM ARMCHIAR COURSES

 

Bigears, you can hide behind a user name, but I do more in a season than you do in a life time, lets see if your still in the game next year, or moved on to something else ????

[bigears 205]

to see them on the fens, doing 2-3 minute courses, (which is actualy a long time for a course), is like watching paint dry

 

 

I feel the exact same way. I am not knockin them. If thats what you like then so be it but I want it fast as can be.

 

Dan, there's been people on here said their dog had a 20 minute run, (!!!!), on a fox; Christ, I would have went to the pub and had a couple of pints, then came back to see the end of the course ! The real coursing lads timed the courses, and a 2-3 minute would be classed as a "grueller" !

 

Cheers. JUST AS I THOUGHT SAT IN THE PUB TALKING ABOUT IT,WE CALL THEM ARMCHIAR COURSES

 

Bigears, you can hide behind a user name, but I do more in a season than you do in a life time, lets see if your still in the game next year, or moved on to something else ????

[/quote a dreamer as well

[miles 227]

This is debate CP not an argument and yes i do disagree with you.

 

A dog CAN be to fast, if were talking about single handed hare and not just on the fens. The ideal is- a fast dog that runs "within its self" IE does not incur oxygen debt and the resulting build up of lactic acid.

 

A run at a good winter hare,given a fair start, is a middle distance event ,like you stated 2-3min. Set off to fast in a middle (or long distance distance event) and you soon move from the aerobic to the anaerobic (oxygen debt).

 

It doesn't matter how game a dog (or person) is if the muscles are writing checks the lungs cant cash, lactic acid build up and its all over

 

BE is right when he says a hare will only run as fast as its "pushed" a fast dog( or should i say a dog that is running to fast) will push a hare to cover.

 

The very best dogs get up to their hare nice and smart and you can see it "gear down" as it gets there. This were the course starts, the dog will literally "slow" the hare up and get it under control by preventing it from were it wants to go.

It doesn't wait for a mistake, but goes up through the gears to pick up.

 

Yes a dog has to be fast ENOUGH to get there, but yes a dog CAN be to fast. JMO

[dodger 3,453]

Good thread lads,for me the second post says it all, some good replys.

[chartpolski 26,558]

This is debate CP not an argument and yes i do disagree with you.

 

A dog CAN be to fast, if were talking about single handed hare and not just on the fens. The ideal is- a fast dog that runs "within its self" IE does not incur oxygen debt and the resulting build up of lactic acid.

 

A run at a good winter hare,given a fair start, is a middle distance event ,like you stated 2-3min. Set off to fast in a middle (or long distance distance event) and you soon move from the aerobic to the anaerobic (oxygen debt).

 

It doesn't matter how game a dog (or person) is if the muscles are writing checks the lungs cant cash, lactic acid build up and its all over

 

BE is right when he says a hare will only run as fast as its "pushed" a fast dog( or should i say a dog that is running to fast) will push a hare to cover.

 

You'r right mate, it IS a debate, shouldn't be an argument ! And I defer to you're knowledge of coursing dogs. I haven't the experience of Fen/match dogs that you have, even though I may have ran as many hares as you, under different circumstances ! LOL! My origional point was; I cannot believe that people think a dog can be "to fast" ! I have a pup for next year, her uncle is Weastmead Hawk, I hope she is as fast as him !!!!

 

Cheers.

[bigears 205]

This is debate CP not an argument and yes i do disagree with you.

 

A dog CAN be to fast, if were talking about single handed hare and not just on the fens. The ideal is- a fast dog that runs "within its self" IE does not incur oxygen debt and the resulting build up of lactic acid.

 

A run at a good winter hare,given a fair start, is a middle distance event ,like you stated 2-3min. Set off to fast in a middle (or long distance distance event) and you soon move from the aerobic to the anaerobic (oxygen debt).

 

It doesn't matter how game a dog (or person) is if the muscles are writing checks the lungs cant cash, lactic acid build up and its all over

 

BE is right when he says a hare will only run as fast as its "pushed" a fast dog( or should i say a dog that is running to fast) will push a hare to cover.

 

The very best dogs get up to their hare nice and smart and you can see it "gear down" as it gets there. This were the course starts, the dog will literally "slow" the hare up and get it under control by preventing it from were it wants to go.

It doesn't wait for a mistake, but goes up through the gears to pick up.

 

Yes a dog has to be fast ENOUGH to get there, but yes a dog CAN be to fast. JMO

WELL SAID

[chartpolski 26,558]

Miles is, I believe, an out and out coursing man; and I respect him for that. I, on the other hand am an all rounder, hunting, shooting, fishing, etc., but my passion is running dogs, and I have a fair experience of it. I give my opinion; and listen to others opinions; but we get people on here who have been in the game 5 minutes, pontificating about dogs and hunting, who won't listen to other peoples views.... So it's pointless arguing with them, let them get on with it. Good luck for the rest of the season, lads !

 

Cheers.

[inan 841]

This is debate CP not an argument and yes i do disagree with you.

 

A dog CAN be to fast, if were talking about single handed hare and not just on the fens. The ideal is- a fast dog that runs "within its self" IE does not incur oxygen debt and the resulting build up of lactic acid.

 

A run at a good winter hare,given a fair start, is a middle distance event ,like you stated 2-3min. Set off to fast in a middle (or long distance distance event) and you soon move from the aerobic to the anaerobic (oxygen debt).

 

It doesn't matter how game a dog (or person) is if the muscles are writing checks the lungs cant cash, lactic acid build up and its all over

 

BE is right when he says a hare will only run as fast as its "pushed" a fast dog( or should i say a dog that is running to fast) will push a hare to cover.

 

The very best dogs get up to their hare nice and smart and you can see it "gear down" as it gets there. This were the course starts, the dog will literally "slow" the hare up and get it under control by preventing it from were it wants to go.

It doesn't wait for a mistake, but goes up through the gears to pick up.

 

Yes a dog has to be fast ENOUGH to get there, but yes a dog CAN be to fast. JMO

Excellent post from some one who knows what they are talking about,which is not a given on here.

[inan 841]

Ya, our coyote courses are between 30 seconds and 2 minutes.

That surprises me Dan ,I would have thought they were much longer,as I beleive the coyote can stay quite well.Ive learned something new.

[chartpolski 26,558]

Ya, our coyote courses are between 30 seconds and 2 minutes.

That surprises me Dan ,I would have thought they were much longer,as I beleive the coyote can stay quite well.Ive learned something new.

 

Inan, your'e a coursing man..... surley you know that 2 minutes in the mind is a lot different from 2 minutes on the clock !

 

Cheers.

[inan 841]

thank you dan 2GOOD you stand corrected

disagree ,you say dogs cant learn to be clever \i say they can ,and run how you teach them

SO U HAVE A DOG THAT RUNS 100% FLAT OUT? SO SUCH DOGS ARE VERY KEEN.SO A DOG THAT DONT LEARN TO TEMPER ITS PACE WILL CERTAINLY TAKE INJURIES,BE IT MUSCULAR/SKELETAL/OR FROM OBSTACLES SUCH AS BARBED WIRE. SO ITS EITHER GONNA LEARN 2 RUN A BIT SMARTER OR BY THE TIME ITS GOT OVER ITS INJURY IT WILL BE MAD KEEN WHEN TAKEN OUT AGAIN & RISK INJURY ALL OVER AGAIN???? ITS FINDING THAT BALANCE INBETWEEN & ITS A LOT EASIER SAID THAN DONE, COS IVE TRIED IT 4 YEARS.THERES NO WORSE FEELING THAN SITTING IN THE HOUSE & ITS BLOWING A GALE OUTSIDE OR GETTING DRAGGED SHOPPING COS U HAVE AN INJURED DOG IN THE KENNEL & NOTHING BETTER 2 DO.

no my dogs run how i want them to ,

 

 

if i buy a greyhound pup,,,,can u train for me to win the irish derby and english derby,,,,,ill go haver,s on the prize money ££££££££££££££££

only if you can arrange for the derby to be run in the dark ,this is a sensible thread ,so unless you can contribute ,then piss of and play else where .

The crux of it is that the original thread was "Can a dog be too fast"?

You introduced lamping into the equation, and said that a dog can be trained to slow down ,by switching off the lamp,during a run,personally I think this may work for some dogs,it might equally result in a dog ,pulling up, or running with its nose.

It certainly is not applicable to daytime running.Which all your posts on this thread have NOT been about.

Some dogs learn to run within themselves ,often in their second and third season , some dogs,especially the greyhound saturated ones ,never learn .Some allmost do it from day one , particularly the heavily saluki blooded ones.

Lamping bunnies is good sport ,but bears little relevance, or similarity to daytime coursing,many coursing men will not lamp ,as they believe it is detrimental to a purpose -bred coursing dog,encouraging it to pull up at hedges.

[inan 841]

Ya, our coyote courses are between 30 seconds and 2 minutes.

That surprises me Dan ,I would have thought they were much longer,as I beleive the coyote can stay quite well.Ive learned something new.

 

Inan, your'e a coursing man..... surley you know that 2 minutes in the mind is a lot different from 2 minutes on the clock !

 

Cheers.

Point taken! How many times have I heard someone say "that must have been about 4/5 mins"? Estimations of the duration of a course are often like estimations of the length of a slip, very subjective,and dependant on who is doing it!

I would not attempt to engage Miles in a debate on

running dogs ,unless I wanted to learn something,he knows his stuff!

Edited February 3, 2010 by inan

[chartpolski 26,558]

Ya, our coyote courses are between 30 seconds and 2 minutes.

That surprises me Dan ,I would have thought they were much longer,as I beleive the coyote can stay quite well.Ive learned something new.

 

Inan, your'e a coursing man..... surley you know that 2 minutes in the mind is a lot different from 2 minutes on the clock !

 

Cheers.

Point taken! How many times have I heard someone say "that must have been about 4/5 mins"? Estimations of the duration of a course are often like estimations of the length of a slip, very subjective,and dependant on who is doing it!

I would not attempt to engage Miles in a debate on

running dogs ,unless I wanted to learn something,he knows his stuff!

 

Probably the first time we've agreed, Inan !!

 

Cheers.