ive got 2 borders 1 from working lines with no papers and 1 with, 1 without is a 11 year old dog who does everything said above, gets stuck, kills his quarry he started going good at about 2 year old mark, as for the the kc bitch she is 14 months a small bitch and has shown good interest at a couple of digs towards end of season. another point about borders is there good all rounders ratting, beating, rabbits etc i also make the point it doesny matter about papers as its the dog who decides weather going to do job or not!