gnasher16 29,649 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 So...........and sorry for sounding like a gullible naive twat !!............If i had one in an aviary unrung,as long as i dont sell it at a show or auction.........im not doing anything wrong ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
the_stig 6,614 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 (edited) So...........and sorry for sounding like a gullible naive twat !!............If i had one in an aviary unrung,as long as i dont sell it at a show or auction.........im not doing anything wrong ? in short gnash --no or I am I wrong ? Edited May 31, 2013 by the_stig Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jonah. 775 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 i might be wrong gnash, but, you could potentially be accused of illegally trapping a wild bird, should anyone with the power / authority to do anything about find an unrung bird in a private aviary 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Millet 4,497 Posted May 31, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 So...........and sorry for sounding like a gullible naive twat !!............If i had one in an aviary unrung,as long as i dont sell it at a show or auction.........im not doing anything wrong ? Load's are missed during the rining/breeding season through one thing or another..i have a couple of adult's here that where not rung for one reason or another...BUT aslong as you can prove where they came from you are ok..and if you do know anyone with legit unrung bird's they should go for free :yes: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Outlaw Pete 2,224 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 Rung two goldie chick's 2hr's ago and it is hit and miss if they stay on ... Millet, I've been thinking about this. (Like, I'm sure,Thousands of f**king people have, since the fifties!) Is there no way of helping ensure those close rings just stay put for the few, vital hours? I have a notion of the difficulties you guys face. Tarsus barely as long as the depth of the ring. Rubbery little feet? We (Ringers) wouldn't even look at such young birds. We have the privilege of waiting till the legs are well developed and the feet huge. It's got to be something wafer thin ~ you have no room to play with. It must be rubbery soft ~ any abrasion and the leg will come off! It mustn't attract the hen's attention ~ See above! I'm no engineer. But, I have this notion of silicone. Tiny little slithers of split, 'rubber' ring? Shouldn't impede the natural growth. And should be less obvious to the hen than the actual ring ....? Granted; Extra hassle, getting that, *As Well* on there. But, it'd make sure the Real ring stayed on, for the required time. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KittleRox 2,147 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 So...........and sorry for sounding like a gullible naive twat !!............If i had one in an aviary unrung,as long as i dont sell it at a show or auction.........im not doing anything wrong ? no you're not doing anything wrong gnash but if you've rung your youngsters and keep a record book with dates bred rung etc it gives you peace of mind if you were to get a knock on the door 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
fireman 10,774 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 The law states it's down to the bird owner to prove it's not a wild bird,i've missed a greenie chick this year and it only really affects the sale or showing of the bird.I have both rung parents and have breeding /hatching dates all written down so if the knock at the door came i can prove with DNA the bird is captive bred,but like i say the law states WE HAVE TO PROVE IT,not they have to show were guilty,not ringing your birds is not against the law but a aviary full of unrung natives is a excuse for that knock to come and we all know how clever the rspca is and the hassle they bring even when their wrong.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Millet 4,497 Posted June 1, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Just checked them and the ring's have stayed on.. and i got the 3rd one done and i hazard a guess they will stay put.. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gnasher16 29,649 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 .I have both rung parents and have breeding /hatching dates all written down so if the knock at the door came i can prove with DNA the bird is captive bred,but like i say the law states WE HAVE TO PROVE IT, Not to play devils advocate.............but if thats as it is......if you lost/sold the parents or they died........................that youngster then becomes an illegal bird ?......as you have nothing to dna it against ?...........Surely a piece of paper with breeding/hatching dates aint worth tuppence in terms of proof without the parents and potential dna. Obviously we,re talking extreme lengths here........and i guess theres no real reason or excuse not to ring the youngsters,like someone said for peace of mind if nothing else. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
fireman 10,774 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 A very grey area Gnasher and you are right hence why it is a good idea to get breeding history and personal details from the breeders if you buy birds but who's going to tell all strangers who buy at a sale where they live?,i sure as hell wouldn't myself but then i don't sell my birds(but those folk who have had birds from me have all my details and there to pass them over to the powers that be if they ever need to as again,i'm 100% legal with my birds ) and i keep a full history and have all the parents dead(frozen for stuffing one day ) and alive of all the birds i've bred.But like you say who's to say all our birds that we didn't breed are captive bred? and this is why it's all a ball ache with natives as once that knock comes it can be hard work for us to prove were not guilty and like no other bit of british law it is up to us to prove our innocence,not them to prove us guilty.The reason i keep detailed breeding history is due to it would help me if i ever had to prove myself as it is evidence for my case and with that and DNA proof all my birds i have or bred are all 100% covered and it'd be a proper waste of there time and money to try to prove otherwise.The closed ring is ment to be the proof of captive breeding but the law changes the goal posts to suit and all we can do is try to find ways of helping ourselves cover ourselves and the breeding history helps with this . 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jonah. 775 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 A very grey area Gnasher and you are right hence why it is a good idea to get breeding history and personal details from the breeders if you buy birds but who's going to tell all strangers who buy at a sale where they live?,i sure as hell wouldn't myself but then i don't sell my birds(but those folk who have had birds from me have all my details and there to pass them over to the powers that be if they ever need to as again,i'm 100% legal with my birds ) and i keep a full history and have all the parents dead(frozen for stuffing one day ) and alive of all the birds i've bred.But like you say who's to say all our birds that we didn't breed are captive bred? and this is why it's all a ball ache with natives as once that knock comes it can be hard work for us to prove were not guilty and like no other bit of british law it is up to us to prove our innocence,not them to prove us guilty.The reason i keep detailed breeding history is due to it would help me if i ever had to prove myself as it is evidence for my case and with that and DNA proof all my birds i have or bred are all 100% covered and it'd be a proper waste of there time and money to try to prove otherwise.The closed ring is ment to be the proof of captive breeding but the law changes the goal posts to suit and all we can do is try to find ways of helping ourselves cover ourselves and the breeding history helps with this . apologies if i'm teaching my granny to suck eggs here fireman, but what you've described right there is called due diligence, you'd be surprised how far that "covering your arse" law has spread these days, especially when dealing with anything to do with manufacturing / serving and selling to joe public 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jonah. 775 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Just checked them and the ring's have stayed on.. and i got the 3rd one done and i hazard a guess they will stay put.. fair play millet, your on fire me mon, chuffed to bits that the craigy boy auction is playing out well.... 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
the_stig 6,614 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 ?? do you ring them the same as pigeons -- its a fixed ring you go over the front toes move the back toe up the leg slide it over it --job done with pigeons there upside down so when the birds in your hands your reading it the right way up... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
fireman 10,774 Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 Yes Stig,just the same but myself i just slide them on and if there right way up then that's a bonus as there a lot smaller and fiddly than pigeon rings so i'm just glad when they go on rather than what way round they are. . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Millet 4,497 Posted June 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 To be honest fireman i don't have a clue which way they went on and i don't care.. ..they are on and that's all that matter's to me.. ..and the way i look at it..it's no real hardship turning the bird left or right while holding it to look at the ring.. .. Stig It's far to fiddley and delicate with these small chick's to worry about a minor problem like that IMO..i have done plenty of pigeon's in my younger year's and it nothing compared do doing these delicate little thing's.. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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