MY POST???

[Guest SJM]

This has grown arms and legs hasnt it?

 

I must admit Baz's posts are the only sensible ones on this thread, he makes a really good point, what do all these collie, bedlington, bull crosses etc lack that makes them unable to compete in the big league? Why dont all the top matching lads who run for big money have collie crosses or bull crosses etc if they are so good?

 

I dont think anyone will ever know for sure, but salukis definately possess some kind of inner strength/stamina which allows them to keep on running when other dogs will buckle. My collie crosses have tons of stamina at their own pace ie they can hunt all day, rake around, put rabbits out of the rough, catch them, keep on hunting on and on. I dont keep a dog that comes in for a walk beside me or behind me of its own accord. The only time my dogs are at my side is if I tell them to be there. I admire stamina in a dog, in its various different forms, and my dogs have stamina in that sense of the word, but I am the first to admit that if a strong hare gets up in the wintertime, in a flat field, they will only be any good on it for the first few bends or until the hare makes a mistake. Once the hare drops a gear and puts the ears back, my dogs have got no chance. The hare is simply too good an athlete for them to be able to do anything other than exercise it. Now collies and bull terriers are both breeds which have a lot of stamina I speak from experience as I have hunted with pure collies as well as pure bull terriers, although from what Ive seen and done, the collie will always be wanting more when the bull is lying with its tongue out, so why neither of these breeds can live with a saluki cross on the big land, I dont know! It must be a genetic thing due to the saluki being bred for centuries for the purpose of distance running and culled harshly. Why is it so many people would rather bum their dogs up than admit they have short comings?

 

How were your weetabix Snoops

[shaun v 3]

im not saying the couldnt kill decent hauls on the lamp but what is the ingredient that stops them being able to kill hares regulary daytime? if they can kill 20 on the lamp, why arnt all the daytime lads using them for matching,,there has to be something missing,,,its either speed or stamina..i dont mean this as an argument it would just be nice to put an end to the continuing argument..why cant the collie/minshaw x kill hares regular in daytime???? saluki x can do it daytime and on the lamp....there is a few lads on here that use saluki x for ferreting, lamping ,bushing etc..but how many serious coursing lads are running colllie/minshaw dogs????

some people will never listen and learn baz i used to get this 20yrs ago around here,, then suddenly the majority of people who owned collie x's or snacks who slagged me off saying your dogs wont kill anything around here , suddenly started to use the saluki blood in there breeds, and not many of them will ever run on the fens

[skycat 6,172]

One of the things I've noticed about Saluki crosses and pure Salukis of course is that they know when to conserve their energy and when to turn it on. You only have to look at a GOOD Saluki type running on the fens to see how it goes into cruise mode when the hare is in the open, letting the hare run a while and use some of its energy, before zooming in and testing the hare to see if its ready to be picked up. Collies and the like just run all out all the time, and they need to if theyr'e to stay with a good hare.

 

I reckon the build of the Saluki with its very long legs and somewhat shorter back (in comparison to its legs) means they can cover the ground much faster and with less effort than a Collie type who is running all blood and guts and thunder. Saluki types have gears which they learn how to use very early on, and they don't waste energy running in top gear when they don't have to. This must have been bred into them over the millenia running in vast areas where the game doesn't go to ground too readily or at all.

 

I know what you mean about Collies crosses grafting hard all day out bushing lamping etc: they are masters of this: mine could catch a hare on the fens with fair law but only if they could catch the hare after a couple of turns.after that it was bye bye hare, though I did have a little bitch that would run them as long as they were in sight then put her nose down and hunt them up again if they clapped down in a dyke or went into cover. Not the same as wearing a fit hare down in the open though impressive to watch all the same.

 

And......how many Saluki types learn to run hares to the edge of a dyke before taking it on the edge when the hare has faltered fractionally as it decides whether to jump, turn out in to the field again or clap down in long grass: not stupid at all these dogs when it comes to reading the game.

 

I've only ever had a couple of what I would call 'complete all rounder', 3 out of 3 on the fens who could also lamp small fields for rabbits: but they only had about 1/4 Saluki in them and their stamina wasn't quite the same as say a half or 3/4 Saluki type. 3 or 4 hard runs (working runs as opposed to straight chases lasting 3-4 minutes on the fens per 5 days was all I used to give them, but then I've never been the sort of person to carry a dog off the field either: I always left the field with another run left in the dog.

[Guest joe ox]

The top and bottom of this argument is a Heavy saturated saluki x is without doubt the best option for daytime hares on the fens and large fields, saluki's have been bred for centurys to do so, but do not make good all round dogs yes maybe there is the odd 1 that can turn its hand to a few different things. Other crosses and there are many are much more suited to be all rounders.

[shaun v 3]

The top and bottom of this argument is a Heavy saturated saluki x is without doubt the best option for daytime hares on the fens and large fields, saluki's have been bred for centurys to do so, but do not make good all round dogs yes maybe there is the odd 1 that can turn its hand to a few different things. Other crosses and there are many are much more suited to be all rounders.

you say heavily saturated saluki's would be the best option ? so what amount would you put into them ?

[Guest joe ox]

The top and bottom of this argument is a Heavy saturated saluki x is without doubt the best option for daytime hares on the fens and large fields, saluki's have been bred for centurys to do so, but do not make good all round dogs yes maybe there is the odd 1 that can turn its hand to a few different things. Other crosses and there are many are much more suited to be all rounders.

you say heavily saturated saluki's would be the best option ? so what amount would you put into them ?

 

Personly if that was my game i would import a pure saliki from working lines in asia and use that. The problem is that quite a few people on here are breed blind are you?

[Guest SJM]

would you say that being breed blind means you go on and on about one particular type or even strain of lurchers and claim them to be the best to the exclusion of all others?

[Guest joe ox]

would you say that being breed blind means you go on and on about one particular type or even strain of lurchers and claim them to be the best to the exclusion of all others?

 

Quote me on saying that! when ever you hear the word minshaw mentioned you go on and on about your personal feud with apw

[Guest SJM]

Yes your right I do have a personal feud with APW but I was actually debating the issue of "breed blindness" with you Im interested to know what your definition of it is and if its the same as mine?

[shaun v 3]

, breed blind lol, just use the right dog for job and not many pure saluki's are used down there.

all of mine are brought up on small land bushing lamping , marking walls then are run down the fens

[Guest joe ox]

Yes your right I do have a personal feud with APW but I was actually debating the issue of "breed blindness" with you Im interested to know what your definition of it is and if its the same as mine?

 

My defination of breed blindness is a person who uses a particular type of breed and carnt see its short falls/refuses to accept other breeds are better at other jobs . Whats yours?

[Guest joe ox]

, breed blind lol, just use the right dog for job and not many pure saluki's are used down there.

all of mine are brought up on small land bushing lamping , marking walls then are run down the fens

 

Why are you getting frustrated? How much saluki is in your dogs and whats there kill ratio on hares on the fens?

Edited August 16, 2007 by joe ox

[Guest SJM]

My defination of breed blindness is a person who uses a particular type of breed and carnt see its short falls/refuses to accept other breeds are better at other jobs . Whats yours?

 

Yep that just about nails it - glad we can agree on something

[Guest bitsa lurcher]

i would say horse's for course's , i have tried a saluki x once and found the dog to be to big for the ground i work on , he was quite big ...29 inch tts .......where as on the same ground a 24 inch tts bull x will catch a lot more ......... having said that i will be the first to addmitt that the 24 inch bull x would not be a match for the saluki x ............so there we have it get a dog that suites the ground that you cover edited to add the saluki x was acctually collie/grey x saluki/grey

who says it was the saluki that made it no good, maybe it was the collie I'm not surprised at 29 inchs try a 24- 25 inch saluki x and see if you can say the same .

 

a very good point perhaps it was the collie that made him no good where i hunt , and who knows i might just try a 24-25 inch saluki x or if i come across a good stud dog i might use him on my collie x ....which ever ......

[Guest SHOT]

CRACKING THREAD LADS