Ireland Fuel Protests

[chartpolski 30,274]

Just now, WILF said:

It is binary, you either support the right to protest or you don’t !

It’s the reason for the protest you get to choose. 
I remember that JSO thread and remember people calling for all sorts of draconian measures against those people…..and I also remember saying “Careful what you wish for lads, what about the day it’s your thing you care about”

See how that works ?

It wasn’t just you in fairness so I’m not singling you out and it is of course fine to say “I wrong, I’ve changed my mind” 

Then we have differing opinions , as I’ve said many times in the past, I can respect anyone’s opinion without necessarily agreeing with them

I thought I’d answered your question but I’ll elaborate.

I listened to Duffy’s interview and he said the rise in the price of fuel, feed, fertiliser, etc is going to mean farm closing. More food will have to be imported, increasing prices to the consumer. This could be alleviated if the government reduced taxes on fuel.

I found that eminently sensible, and back civil protest in that scenario.

I don’t back civil protest when JSO slash paintings, desecrate graves, etc. or destroying our military infrastructure.

I agree with jailing people who openly support a proscribed terrorist group; Palestine Action, they knew exactly what would happen but goaded the police into arresting them.

So no, I don’t see it as binary, and find no contradiction whatsoever in supporting some protests and not others.

But, as allways, that’s just my views

Cheers.

 

[dai dogs 2,433]

UK.

[WILF 53,367]

1 minute ago, chartpolski said:

Then we have differing opinions , as I’ve said many times in the past, I can respect anyone’s opinion without necessarily agreeing with them

I thought I’d answered your question but I’ll elaborate.

I listened to Duffy’s interview and he said the rise in the price of fuel, feed, fertiliser, etc is going to mean farm closing. More food will have to be imported, increasing prices to the consumer. This could be alleviated if the government reduced taxes on fuel.

I found that eminently sensible, and back civil protest in that scenario.

I don’t back civil protest when JSO slash paintings, desecrate graves, etc. or destroying our military infrastructure.

I agree with jailing people who openly support a proscribed terrorist group; Palestine Action, they knew exactly what would happen but goaded the police into arresting them.

So no, I don’t see it as binary, and find no contradiction whatsoever in supporting some protests and not others.

But, as allways, that’s just my views

Cheers.

 

Ok mate, well I’m not suffering with selective memory so I’ll remind everyone how loads of you wanted people put in prison or forcibly removed by the police for doing exactly what the Irish lads are doing and blocking roads and bringing traffic to a standstill !

I’ll also remind everyone how loads of you said I was a nutcase for saying “Good for them, I back their right to protest” and how you all said various nonsense about “The right way to protest” and “Stopping ambulances” and “Essential medical appointments” and all the other crap the government tell you to believe. 

You said it, not me……I said “good for them standing up for what they believe” then and I say “Good for them standing up for what they believe” now !

The cost of my freedom is their freedom…..as I kept telling loads of you ! lol 

 

[chartpolski 30,274]

1 minute ago, WILF said:

Ok mate, well I’m not suffering with selective memory so I’ll remind everyone how loads of you wanted people put in prison or forcibly removed by the police for doing exactly what the Irish lads are doing and blocking roads and bringing traffic to a standstill !

I’ll also remind everyone how loads of you said I was a nutcase for saying “Good for them, I back their right to protest” and how you all said various nonsense about “The right way to protest” and “Stopping ambulances” and “Essential medical appointments” and all the other crap the government tell you to believe. 

You said it, not me……I said “good for them standing up for what they believe” then and I say “Good for them standing up for what they believe” now !

The cost of my freedom is their freedom…..as I kept telling loads of you ! lol 

 

That’s saying we may be hypocritical, not that we have a binary choice to either support ALL protests or support NONE.

Let me use the old “reductio ad absurdum”

Theres two protests going , one in support of fox hunting, one in support of banning fox hunting.

I can vehemently support one protest and vehemently oppose the other.

Not all protests have the same level of legitimacy, a bored undergraduate    living on mummy and daddy’s trust fund, gluing themself  to a road in the narcissistic hope the government will stop using fossil fuels isn’t the same as a farmer taking action to save his livelihood.

Cheers.

[WILF 53,367]

Just now, chartpolski said:

That’s saying we may be hypocritical, not that we have a binary choice to either support ALL protests or support NONE.

It’s hypocritical to support one persons RIGHT to protest and not another’s…..if they don’t have the RIGHT then neither do you.

Just now, chartpolski said:

Let me use the old “reductio ad absurdum”

Theres two protests going , one in support of fox hunting, one in support of banning fox hunting.

I can vehemently support one protest and vehemently oppose the other.

They are the causes of the protest, not the protest itself !

You get to decide what cause you support not who gets the right to protest. 

Just now, chartpolski said:

Not all protests have the same level of legitimacy, a bored undergraduate    living on mummy and daddy’s trust fund, gluing themself  to a road in the narcissistic hope the government will stop using fossil fuels isn’t the same as a farmer taking action to save his livelihood.

Cheers.

Of course they have the same levels of legitimacy, it’s only the cause of the protest you can make that judgement on.

Said all this before…..

[Bendigo 2,484]

Interesting comments on both sides and I find myself agreeing with both in turn....though I find myself more leaning towards charts though I'm aware that it maybe a little hypocritical. Please do continue gents

[dai dogs 2,433]

Apparently the Army has refused to move them 

[chartpolski 30,274]

1 minute ago, WILF said:

It’s hypocritical to support one persons RIGHT to protest and not another’s…..if they don’t have the RIGHT then neither do you.

They are the causes of the protest, not the protest itself !

You get to decide what cause you support not who gets the right to protest. 

Of course they have the same levels of legitimacy, it’s only the cause of the protest you can make that judgement on.

Said all this before…..

 

Don’t be doing an mC on me You started off by saying “ but you don’t support protests”,  it’s a binary choice, you either support protests or you don’t.

What you’re  saying is if I supported the miners protest, I must support the BLM protest.

If I don’t support the JSO protest, I can’t support the protest against the Hunting Act

That’s nonsense however you look at it .

Cheers.

[WILF 53,367]

4 minutes ago, Bendigo said:

Interesting comments on both sides and I find myself agreeing with both in turn....though I find myself more leaning towards charts though I'm aware that it maybe a little hypocritical. Please do continue gents

It’s easy, there’s two protests…..

One is a Reform stop the boats protest

One is a Palestine action protest

Last year you applauded as the government locked up just stop oil

The government now have that power mandated and applauded by load of the people who intend to go on the Reform protest…..

The government decide Palestine action is OK and they decide to lock up anyone at the Reform protest……you gave them the power to do that. 

However, if you had just backed everyone’s right to protest, they could not  lock any of you up !

That’s it in a nutshell ! 

[WILF 53,367]

1 minute ago, chartpolski said:

 

Don’t be doing an mC on me You started off by saying “ but you don’t support protests”,  it’s a binary choice, you either support protests or you don’t.

What you’re  saying is if I supported the miners protest, I must support the BLM protest.

If I don’t support the JSO protest, I can’t support the protest against the Hunting Act

That’s nonsense however you look at it .

Cheers.

You’re getting confused, you are confusing the purpose of the protest with the act of the protest….

[WILF 53,367]

I did try and explain all this to loads of you the other year ! lol 

[Halfhound 1,285]

I think there’s one difference between this protest and JSO. These are ordinary business owners and workers who are showing the country that it’s not huge haulage firms that keep the country afloat and it’s not big company’s that the country really depends on. It’s the small man who shows up every day to keep things moving. And just as they keep things moving they can bring it all to a stop at any given moment. This really is people power and reality is nothing can really be done to stop us only listen. There has been no vandalism or destruction caused by any of this. 

[chartpolski 30,274]

8 minutes ago, WILF said:

You’re getting confused, you are confusing the purpose of the protest with the act of the protest….

No, I’m quoting you verbatim when you said I don’t support protests, I gave my answer and said it’s not a binary choice to support or not support protests, you said it was binary, I gave instances and reasons where I could support some protest and not others 

If you chose to expand the discussion , that’s fine , but I stand totally by my assertion that I can support or not support whatever protest I chose.

Anyhow, must go , got dogs and chickens to feed

Cheers.

Edited 19 hours ago by chartpolski

[WILF 53,367]

1 minute ago, chartpolski said:

No, I’m quoting you verbatim when you said I don’t support protests, I gave my answer and said it’s not a binary choice to support or not support protests, you said it was binary, I gave instances and reasons where I could support some protest and not others 

If you chose to expand the discussion , that’s fine , but I stand totally by my assertion that I can support or not support what’re protest I chose.

Anyhow, must go , got dogs and chickens to feed

Cheers.

The support of the right to protest is absolutely binary !…..you either do or you don’t !

[chartpolski 30,274]

1 hour ago, WILF said:

But you don’t support protests like this mate ?

 

You didn’t mention “the RIGHT” to protest. I answered your question .

Cheers

Edited 19 hours ago by chartpolski