Two footed tackles!!!

[gnasher16 29,835]

Well i didnt expect that mate!! I thought you would have been one for seeing a nice firm but fair sliding tackle? What would happen then if all sliding tackles were outlawed, we'd never get to see that last ditch tackle that blocks a goal and saves a game?

I never knew of the training techniques of Holland and Spanish sides actually, maybe this is the reason they are more skillful as they stay on ther feet more of the time but it would also explain when British teams play them in European tournamnets there falling about all over the place like they've been shot. I'd hate the game to be more like that and sadly it looks like we are heading towards it..

 

Im a West Ham fan mate....." The Academy of Football ".....we have always been associated with flair players and teams that play good football......ok we,re coming up short in recent years but we never changed our philosophy of the game ( well until wham bam whack it Sam came along that is )

Labtastic i think if a defender is badly positioned or not quick enough when a striker is through on goal then the sliding tackle should not be able to save him.........the sliding tackle amongst other things is a way for slow defenders to get the better of quicker more skillful forwards and thats bad for the skill element of the game.

I agree i dont want all the antics that go on.......but id much rather a game where sheer skill and football ability gets the better over brute force and power..........after all,if you had to watch Barcelona play every week....or Stoke City........i know who id rather watch.

[WILF 44,750]

Well i didnt expect that mate!! I thought you would have been one for seeing a nice firm but fair sliding tackle? What would happen then if all sliding tackles were outlawed, we'd never get to see that last ditch tackle that blocks a goal and saves a game?

I never knew of the training techniques of Holland and Spanish sides actually, maybe this is the reason they are more skillful as they stay on ther feet more of the time but it would also explain when British teams play them in European tournamnets there falling about all over the place like they've been shot. I'd hate the game to be more like that and sadly it looks like we are heading towards it..

 

Im a West Ham fan mate....." The Academy of Football ".....we have always been associated with flair players and teams that play good football......ok we,re coming up short in recent years but we never changed our philosophy of the game ( well until wham bam whack it Sam came along that is )

Labtastic i think if a defender is badly positioned or not quick enough when a striker is through on goal then the sliding tackle should not be able to save him.........the sliding tackle amongst other things is a way for slow defenders to get the better of quicker more skillful forwards and thats bad for the skill element of the game.

I agree i dont want all the antics that go on.......but id much rather a game where sheer skill and football ability gets the better over brute force and power..........after all,if you had to watch Barcelona play every week....or Stoke City........i know who id rather watch.

 

While I absolutely agree about learning to actually play football, I take a slightly different view on tackles pal.

The Dutch system sounds perfect to me and to be honest at a young age, there's no need for anything too over physical.....mentally though, they are very tough on even very young players.

I watched a thing on the PSV and Ajax youth system a long time ago, teams of 8/9 year olds......Ajax were losing at half time and when they got those kids back in the dressing room the coach balled them out with all the aggression that you would a team of adults.

They very much were trying to instill an aggressive winning mentality.

 

IMHO, the only decent rule to come out of FIFA for a long time was the banning of tackles from behind, everything else demands quick thinking, quick feet, skill and vision.

I would always think twice about rolling the ball into the feet of a player who is worrying about getting hit with a tackle, these players are the "hot potatoe" merchants and make bad passing decisions because they are scared and lack the speed or skill or passing vision to avoid the tackle or make a decent cool pass.......watch them try and get near Messi, he ain't worried about getting hit with a tackle, in fact he probably creates more space for himself by being skilful enough to avoid tackles.

Loads of thinking time when the bloke is sliding past you on his arse.

 

Take out tackles and you take out the ability to stay on your feet, you take out the need for quick feet and skill, you take out the quick football brain and moments of brilliance......the very things that separate the great from the ordinary.

I know this is where me and Gnasher part ways a bit, but IMHO if you took out tackles you will loose a massive amount of what makes football the beautiful game because everyone can afford to be mediocre in skill, bottle and physical/mentall ability.

 

And let's be honest, yes football can be dangerous, but riding a horse is more dangerous and it's mostly girls that do that!!! Lol lol

Edited February 18, 2012 by WILF

[stewie 3,387]

my avatar shows the perfect sliding tackle you may aswell take away throw ins if you take away a good tackle imo!!!

[gnasher16 29,835]

Some fair points Wilf.....just a couple of things.....i didnt know that about the Dutch mentality as regards their competetive nature and winning at all costs.....from what im led to believe youngsters over there and indeed Spain and many other countries do not allow their kids to play in competetive leagues until 15/16 years old.......obviously meaning they prefer to work on skills before working on a winning mentality......but this was 10 years ago it might be different now i dont know,i was living over in Holland for 6 months and what i saw of the game there really impressed me at every level.

As regards tackling i wouldnt want it taken out the game altogether........just sliding or 2 footed tackles..............you think how many times a player is clean through by skillfully beating a slower centre half....only to be pulled back by a defender with long legs !.....ok the defender might of got the ball first but if he wasnt quick enough in the first placein mind or body then the attacker should get the advantage in my opinion................besides,the best tacklers in the game never had to rely on sliding about......look at Bobby Moore probably the best tackler the game ever saw in England......he wasnt called " white shorts Bobby " for nothing

[WILF 44,750]

Some fair points Wilf.....just a couple of things.....i didnt know that about the Dutch mentality as regards their competetive nature and winning at all costs.....from what im led to believe youngsters over there and indeed Spain and many other countries do not allow their kids to play in competetive leagues until 15/16 years old.......obviously meaning they prefer to work on skills before working on a winning mentality......but this was 10 years ago it might be different now i dont know,i was living over in Holland for 6 months and what i saw of the game there really impressed me at every level.

As regards tackling i wouldnt want it taken out the game altogether........just sliding or 2 footed tackles..............you think how many times a player is clean through by skillfully beating a slower centre half....only to be pulled back by a defender with long legs !.....ok the defender might of got the ball first but if he wasnt quick enough in the first placein mind or body then the attacker should get the advantage in my opinion................besides,the best tacklers in the game never had to rely on sliding about......look at Bobby Moore probably the best tackler the game ever saw in England......he wasnt called " white shorts Bobby " for nothing

 

I only saw that one programme on the youth academy so I couldn't speake for the whole system mate, these kids were Ajax playing against PSV and the coach took no prisoners....it was brutal.

 

I played centre forward my whole time playing and I tell you, I would 100 percent NOT want them to stop a defending player tackling.......it would have killed at least percent of my game.

I wouldn't have to think about my running off the ball, creating a couple of yards of space, taking half chances......I could not imagine a game without it and I can't imagine I would get any enjoyment from it.

Sure it's nice to pop a few in the net, but it's the whole game that really counts and I could not judge my whole performance against anything less that a committed, full blooded, well organised, hard tackling back 4.

 

You see plenty of lads in training knock goals in for fun, but put them in a competitive game situation and see how many could cut it as a centre forward and score goals on a consistent basis.......you would loose that bit extra that is required to play the position.

I love watching top class defenders, their body position, their timing.......as you know from your time boxing I am sure, it's all phsycology......it's a clash of wills and only one can be the winner......your going to try and impose yourself mentally and physically on your opponent.

 

Even the defender that is forced to make the shitty challenge on you, I like him, a little whisper in his ear telling him that he is struggling, he can't cope with you, your mugging him......it's all part of the phsycology of the game, part of the mental battle.

 

Love talking football with you matey, sorry if I ramble on a bit.

 

 

[martin 332]

My 'tackle' aint quite two foot but it's damn near!

[twobob 1,464]

Some fair points Wilf.....just a couple of things.....i didnt know that about the Dutch mentality as regards their competetive nature and winning at all costs.....from what im led to believe youngsters over there and indeed Spain and many other countries do not allow their kids to play in competetive leagues until 15/16 years old.......obviously meaning they prefer to work on skills before working on a winning mentality......but this was 10 years ago it might be different now i dont know,i was living over in Holland for 6 months and what i saw of the game there really impressed me at every level.

As regards tackling i wouldnt want it taken out the game altogether........just sliding or 2 footed tackles..............you think how many times a player is clean through by skillfully beating a slower centre half....only to be pulled back by a defender with long legs !.....ok the defender might of got the ball first but if he wasnt quick enough in the first placein mind or body then the attacker should get the advantage in my opinion................besides,the best tacklers in the game never had to rely on sliding about......look at Bobby Moore probably the best tackler the game ever saw in England......he wasnt called " white shorts Bobby " for nothing

gnasher i think your being unfair to defenders,if the attacker is so much more skillfull he shouldnt let the defender back at him ,theres more skill in timing a tackle that leaves the striker kicking fresh air imho

[gnasher16 29,835]

I dont bullshit myself Wilf im just a fan ive never played the game and you have it dont matter what level,you understand what happens on a pitch and maybe i dont........i love the game but ive never had no more than a game over the park with mates so its always better to hear the thoughts from folk who have competed

And maybe im only really looking at it from a fans point of view........again,i couldnt see the game without tackling at all........but from that what i saw abroad,and the amount of football i watch on a regular basis its just a theory ive had knocking about in my head......but your not the first person to tell me im talking bollocks whenever the subject comes up the whole lot of my football mates tell me to shut up about it as its just not feasible......i dont know maybe your right......

Ive said many times Bobby Moore was the best tackler in the game and he never had to go sliding about wiping players out......i think a lot of the tackles we see today are not dirty tackles,but they are certainly not skillful challenges....i mean,a defender cant win the ball and come away with it if he,s on his arse...........anyway,great hearing your thoughts mate

[gnasher16 29,835]

]gnasher i think your being unfair to defenders,if the attacker is so much more skillfull he shouldnt let the defender back at him ,theres more skill in timing a tackle that leaves the striker kicking fresh air imho

Yep fair point

[Lab 10,979]

I dont bullshit myself Wilf im just a fan ive never played the game and you have it dont matter what level,you understand what happens on a pitch and maybe i dont........i love the game but ive never had no more than a game over the park with mates so its always better to hear the thoughts from folk who have competed

And maybe im only really looking at it from a fans point of view........again,i couldnt see the game without tackling at all........but from that what i saw abroad,and the amount of football i watch on a regular basis its just a theory ive had knocking about in my head......but your not the first person to tell me im talking bollocks whenever the subject comes up the whole lot of my football mates tell me to shut up about it as its just not feasible......i dont know maybe your right......

Ive said many times Bobby Moore was the best tackler in the game and he never had to go sliding about wiping players out......i think a lot of the tackles we see today are not dirty tackles,but they are certainly not skillful challenges....i mean,a defender cant win the ball and come away with it if he,s on his arse...........anyway,great hearing your thoughts mate

Thats just the thing Gnasher they can..... You see now we have this thing in football where everyone wants to dive, infact theres folk diving before there a tackle even made so when someone slides in with a commited tackle the opposing player dives. If its a perfectly good tackle the defender gets up and gets away and the player that dived should be booked. Until the refs start to do that then diving will increase and tackling will fade out. Sad!!!

[gnasher16 29,835]

Thats just the thing Gnasher they can..... You see now we have this thing in football where everyone wants to dive, infact theres folk diving before there a tackle even made so when someone slides in with a commited tackle the opposing player dives. If its a perfectly good tackle the defender gets up and gets away and the player that dived should be booked. Until the refs start to do that then diving will increase and tackling will fade out. Sad!!!

 

My point is.........look at Lurcher 1,s profile picture as a perfect example......i cant quite see who the players are......but the Everton player clearly has the advantage for whatever reason be it a skillful touch or a good pass.......the Liverpool player has only got the tackle in because he has left his feet and slid into him,hence....he might not of been quick enough,or positionally cute enough to win the ball......but has won it anyway...has he come away with the ball ? no....has his side gained possession of the ball ? no......all he has done is stopped an attacking player,which ok is a defenders job granted.................but if we want to encourage fast attacking football surely the advantage has to be with the attacker until such time as the defender takes the ball off him.......just wiping him out is not winning a tackle even if he gets the ball first.

Again im not saying im right,purely just a thought.

[carp man 1 219]

if u ask me football player these days dont no a good tackel they get knock and there off 4 6 weeks they r on to much money

[RossM 7,979]

Tackling defines a players position on the park.

[martin 332]

I fail to see the problem,when I first started to watch football there were some real hard men,the likes of Ron chopper Harris,Norman Hunter,Billy Bremner,Francis Lee,Terry Payne etc and this lot learnt from them.........

 

[WILF 44,750]

Some of those tackles could have been interpreted either way, but some a truly shocking.....IMHO, Kean should have been banned for life for the challenge on Harland and the same gos for all the similar challenges.

 

There's a world of difference between going in hard and fast on a tackle and genuinely trying to hurt someone badly........you can hit someone with a tackle fair and square and make an impression.

Anything more than 6 inches above the ankle is not a genuine tackle, it's deliberately trying to maim someone.