retreving the real thing?

[Water Badger 26]

Beddy whip is now 18months has caught on the lamp, bushing, ferreting etc he has been taught to retreive dummy of various sizes and weights skin covered etc.

 

he comes out with me stalking rabbits and shooting from the veichle he will not retreive them to hand and I am running out of options I have tried.

• walking away (he leaves the rabbit eventualy and follows me)
  
• walking to him (he pick up the rabbit and moves off)
  
• getting low open arms and calling(he just stands over it mouthing it)
  
• throwing the dead rabbit like a dummy (a half hearted retreive very short)
  

my shooting companion is saying he feels the rabbit is his and i should continuedummy training but swap the dummy for a reward?

 

I dont understand why he will bring a skin dummy I have thrown but not a rabbit I have shot ?

 

tips please

[Run_Rabbit85 8]

try retreiving a dead rabbit instead of a dummie in the garden pal my mate had the same problem see how that goes atb mick........... :thumbs:

[Casso 1,261]

Beddy whip is now 18months has caught on the lamp, bushing, ferreting etc he has been taught to retreive dummy of various sizes and weights skin covered etc.

 

he comes out with me stalking rabbits and shooting from the veichle he will not retreive them to hand and I am running out of options I have tried.

• walking away (he leaves the rabbit eventualy and follows me)
  
• walking to him (he pick up the rabbit and moves off)
  
• getting low open arms and calling(he just stands over it mouthing it)
  
• throwing the dead rabbit like a dummy (a half hearted retreive very short)
  

my shooting companion is saying he feels the rabbit is his and i should continuedummy training but swap the dummy for a reward?

 

I dont understand why he will bring a skin dummy I have thrown but not a rabbit I have shot ?

 

tips please

Bud its so hard to diagnose problems between dog and owner from a few words put down on a site like this,

in my humble experience most problems evolve from dog/owner interaction, especially emotional driven situations, that is ,what a dog comprehends from any situation and what you comprehend may be totally different,

Discipline is a huge one ,not saying its the case with you,,but when a dog is excited and doing something ,usually stems from drive or some form of it, and we let out a few f**ks at it,,is he precieving that he shouldn't do it ,he shouldn't do it with us there ,or that he cant be near us when excited and in drive, that will also differ with different mutts with different temperaments,,so its a nightmare unless you can try to figure out more about the history and interaction of those involved,,,what i would do is have more play and fun interaction,,im not sure how she see's you ,play always helps ,best of luck,,

[Country Joe 1,411]

The best Dog I ever owned was a Whippet x Beddy, would retrieve balls ect when a pup, but in the field she would kill, then leave the rabbit and I had to go and pick up, I know its frustrating and its good to see them retrieve, i also tried a few different things but they didn't work.

Worked her nine Seasons, took a huge amount of rabbits with her, best Ferreting dog I ever owned, I would not have sold her for a Kings ransom, but carrying, she said no, no, no.

[Water Badger 26]

Thanks lads some great replys

 

[skycat 6,174]

Like Casso says, its impossible to 'teach' someone on a forum. There is body language: both yours and the dogs: what is your body language saying to the dog? "Oh PLEASE bring me that rabbit...!!" In which case you are ASKING the dog, maybe even PLEADING with it, to give up something it has learned is a very highly valued item, so possibly giving the dog something over which it has CONTROL.

 

I've ruined a dog or two for retrieving by running them in the company of other dogs, even though those other dogs might not have been trying to take the rabbit from it.

 

What your'e aiming for is a dog which really WANTS to bring you the rabbit it has caught, in a sort of proud, look-at-me sort of way. I NEVER take a rabbit straight off a lurcher when starting out. We share a moment where the dog is standing in front of me, rabbit in mouth, wagging its tail, whilst I cuddle the dog and praise it. I've even had to walk quite a way with the dog walking beside me still carrying its rabbit, unwilling to give it up. ( I will have killed the rabbit whilst still in the dog's mouth) That's fine by me, sooner or later it gets fed up with carrying it, and I'm watching for that moment, and the moment I see signs that the dog is starting to become less possessive about its prize I take the rabbit's hind legs in one hand and say "Give" I then put the rabbit in my game bag, and even the most peculiar Saluki types learn that the rabbit is safe there, not being left, even the most manky myxie ridden rabbits get treated like that when training a pup.

 

Some dogs you can 'boss' into making the retrieve: but it all depends on the dog, your relationship with the dog, your own ability to read the dog's mind.

 

So how do you make the dog see that the rabbit is your's and not his? How do you make the dog understand that bringing you the rabbit is something which is a reward in itself?

 

Is all your retrieving training really good fun for the dog? What does the dog get out of it? Or is it boring, repetitious 'work' with no real fun to be had for the dog?

 

I play tug of war with reluctant retrievers! Might sound all wrong, but here's a game which a dog really enjoys, especially, during the early stages with pretend rabbits, you allow the dog to 'win' every now and again. If you're doing this right then the dog can 'win' the item, but will quickly return to you carrying the item for another go at tug of war. When that happens you're well on the way to getting a proper retrieve.

 

Obviously you don't want the dog to play tug of war with a real rabbit, but once you are getting the tug of war response, you can then start to control it: I say "Give" in a sharp voice during the tug of war, once the basics are there, then I immediately throw the item, which the dog goes to fetch, and brings to me so we can have that game all over again.

 

You need to cement in the dog's brain that there is a huge reward in actually bringing stuff to you: and you need to be training with a wide variety of objects: especially furry toys.

***

Another thing: is the dog just seeing you shooting rabbits whilst it has to sit there and watch? How boring is that! Might you have been better off getting a gun dog if you only wanted a dog to pick up what you have shot? I know that in theory, all dogs can be trained to retrieve, but might there be some frustration in a dog which is, after all, half terrier, half running dog: seeing all those rabbits running about and not getting to chase them? Forgive me if I have the wrong end of the stick.

 

If this is the case: put yourself in the dog's shoes (err, paws!) He sits there watching, doing nothing, you shoot a rabbit, you tell the dog to fetch, so when he goes out and gets his little teeth round that rabbit he is naturally pretty pissed off to find that there is nothing to do now apart from bringing it to you, which for some reason he finds very unrewarding: do you see where I'm going with this? And he knows that all that will happen if he does bring you this warm, smelly and very appealing prize, is that you'll take it off him and he'll have to sit there all over again watching you shoot.

 

If I'm right about this, then you'll have to do some hard work in getting the dog to see bringing you the rabbit as reward in itself, and that means going back to the drawing board and making it FUN FOR THE DOG TO BRING YOU STUFF.

 

It is so difficult to say all this in writing without seeing you and the dog in action> being there, one on one, I would be able to read the dog and you, and make suggestions.

[Bosun11 537]

Hats off to you Skycat for putting up a cracking and informative repy, same with you Casso too, thats what makes this Forum what it is, people taking the time and effort to help others...

[Water Badger 26]

Well this post has achived many things for me

1. restored faith in THL
   
2. given me some good indications as to what I need to do to rectify mistakes I have made with my beddy whip
   
3. shown me what not to do with my young whippet
   

Thanks to all who have replyed especily Skycat