vermin hunter 1 Posted July 1, 2011 Report Share Posted July 1, 2011 I have recently moved house,so I have had to send my certificates off for the change of address. My old constabulary were West Midlands my new constabulary are Thames Valley. I have 2 shotguns and 1 rifle .17 hmr which I use for vermin control. The firearms officer has just informed me that I cannot use my rifle for fox. He said fox are not classed as vermin !! The conditions on my license are, The holder of this certificate may possess,purchase or acquire expanding ammunition,or the missiles of such ammunition in .17 hmr authorised by this certificate and may use such ammunition only in connection with vermin control The .17 hmr rifle and ammunition to which this certificate relates shall only be used for vermin control and for zeroing on land over which the holder has permission to shoot with that class of firearm from the person by whom shooting rights are owned or from whom they may be leased or otherwise obtained. The firearm(s) may also be used for zeroing at a range suitable for the safe use of that class of firearm and with adequate financial arrangments in place to meet any injury or damage claim. I have never heard of this before. Your thoughts please guys Quote Link to post
Blacksheep 6 Posted July 1, 2011 Report Share Posted July 1, 2011 I have recently moved house,so I have had to send my certificates off for the change of address. My old constabulary were West Midlands my new constabulary are Thames Valley. I have 2 shotguns and 1 rifle .17 hmr which I use for vermin control. The firearms officer has just informed me that I cannot use my rifle for fox. He said fox are not classed as vermin !! The conditions on my license are, The holder of this certificate may possess,purchase or acquire expanding ammunition,or the missiles of such ammunition in .17 hmr authorised by this certificate and may use such ammunition only in connection with vermin control The .17 hmr rifle and ammunition to which this certificate relates shall only be used for vermin control and for zeroing on land over which the holder has permission to shoot with that class of firearm from the person by whom shooting rights are owned or from whom they may be leased or otherwise obtained. The firearm(s) may also be used for zeroing at a range suitable for the safe use of that class of firearm and with adequate financial arrangments in place to meet any injury or damage claim. I have never heard of this before. I have Vermin and Fox on mine (Dyfed Powys ), ask them to add fox to yours if they say they can't , thats good reason to get a variation for a 223 Your thoughts please guys Quote Link to post
lapin2008 1,587 Posted July 1, 2011 Report Share Posted July 1, 2011 (edited) I have recently moved house,so I have had to send my certificates off for the change of address. My old constabulary were West Midlands my new constabulary are Thames Valley. I have 2 shotguns and 1 rifle .17 hmr which I use for vermin control. The firearms officer has just informed me that I cannot use my rifle for fox. He said fox are not classed as vermin !! The conditions on my license are, The holder of this certificate may possess,purchase or acquire expanding ammunition,or the missiles of such ammunition in .17 hmr authorised by this certificate and may use such ammunition only in connection with vermin control The .17 hmr rifle and ammunition to which this certificate relates shall only be used for vermin control and for zeroing on land over which the holder has permission to shoot with that class of firearm from the person by whom shooting rights are owned or from whom they may be leased or otherwise obtained. The firearm(s) may also be used for zeroing at a range suitable for the safe use of that class of firearm and with adequate financial arrangments in place to meet any injury or damage claim. I have never heard of this before. Your thoughts please guys This would have most likely never be intended for use controlling fox. I have very similar on mine except i think it says vermin and ground game. Because 17/22lr are considered borderline for fox by most forces, I believe it would have to explicitly state fox in order to be considered OK in the eyes of the law. I suppose though that the slackness around the definition of vermin could be used for a 'I considered that fox was covered under vermin' argument should it ever be needed. atb Edited July 1, 2011 by lapin2008 Quote Link to post
RicW 67 Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 Home Office advice for FEOs is that no rimfire should be granted "for the purpose of" shooting fox. It depends on the force issuing the FAC. Some will grant "occasional" fox on the ticket, Some just say no! Tell 'em you're planning to use the HMR for rabbit at longer range, grounded pest birds and other vermin, but if Charlie pops his head up you want to be able to put a hole in it. Quote Link to post
Deker 3,453 Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 (edited) Thames Valley like to use the word FOX or Other lawful Quarry. Vermin is not fox in their book. Simple fact is you are still likely to get different responses from FEO to FEO in the same region, and some may accept vermin as fox. ALL my rimfires were conditioned for FOX in Thames Valley until a variation or two back when the any other lawful quarry condition replaced it. People suggest conditions like... Close fox, occasional fox, etc, they are undefinable and unenforceable, and can someone please scan this part of their FAC and show me a condition that dumb! Cheers Edited July 2, 2011 by Deker Quote Link to post
pestcontrol121 11 Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 As i have said in posts before , you must have fox on your certificate and next to the rifle you wish to shoot like this. Quote Link to post
Urban Fox Control London 8 Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 My FAC is issued by Herts. Stating under Additional Conditions: 5. The .22RF Rifle and the ammunition to which this certificate relates shall be used for pest and fox control and for zeroing on ranges or land over which the holder has permission to shoot with that class of firearms from the person by whom the shooting rights are owned or from whom they may be leased or otherwise obtained. Please note: I only dispatch foxes in cage traps with my .22RF Quick, clinical and precise Quote Link to post
Deker 3,453 Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 As i have said in posts before , you must have fox on your certificate and next to the rifle you wish to shoot like this. Not if you have the ANY OTHER LAWFUL QUARRY condition! Quote Link to post
CharlieT 32 Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 As i have said in posts before , you must have fox on your certificate and next to the rifle you wish to shoot like this. Extraordinary, after your force wasting that much ink on your conditions you still can't use your .223 & .243 on vermin. Quote Link to post
HUnter_zero 58 Posted July 2, 2011 Report Share Posted July 2, 2011 He said fox are not classed as vermin "The .17 hmr rifle and ammunition to which this certificate relates shall only be used for vermin control and for zeroing on land over which the holder has permission to shoot with that class of firearm from the person by whom shooting rights are owned or from whom they may be leased or otherwise obtained. The firearm(s) may also be used for zeroing at a range suitable for the safe use of that class of firearm and with adequate financial arrangments in place to meet any injury or damage claim." Your thoughts please guys The FEO is correct. Certificates are granted in terms of quarry and usage. For example " Vermin control", "Fox control", " Deer stalking / control ", "Humane dispatch", "target shooting" etc. I know it seems silly that foxes are not classed as vermin by the police, but it's the way the police assess suitable calibres and that's that. John Quote Link to post
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