Kane 2 Posted March 14, 2006 Report Share Posted March 14, 2006 Know of a bloke .Who has a smashing Saluki bitch (90% saluki anyway).The most foxes Ive seen her take in a single night was 6 she has a bit of trouble killing them so she is generaly ran doubled up (a good bitch to enter a pup with for obvious reasons)She will kill them but can take a little longer than is fair.She has taken quite a lot of punishment in her time but she doesnt even show a sign of chucking the towel in.IMHO like most game dogs her temperament is excellent. Quote Link to post
Kye 77 Posted March 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2006 Is that the B&T owned buy your mate B.....? She looks a great type mate...maybe if he puts her to a Grey, he would sell us a pup?.. Kye,.. Quote Link to post
Kane 2 Posted March 14, 2006 Report Share Posted March 14, 2006 Is that the B&T owned buy your mate B.....?She looks a great type mate...maybe if he puts her to a Grey, he would sell us a pup?.. Kye,.. I think he is considering putting a decent Grew over her. Quote Link to post
Kane 2 Posted March 14, 2006 Report Share Posted March 14, 2006 Also seen some good collie xs on fox (even 1 or 2 Hancocks),seen some good Bedlingtonxs.Also knew a bloke who had a German Shepherd that was good dog to have around terriers bushing foxes killing them if it caught one marking to ground and it used to love drawing. Quote Link to post
Garypco 3 Posted March 14, 2006 Report Share Posted March 14, 2006 What about Kerry Blues.............????.................They were used as working dogs as well as match dogs I dont know much about them but I have heard they were as game as they come............Also some lines of "working" terrier ......... I have said to Turk before that if certain terriers were bigger they would be machines........I imagine gameness comes in all breeds but is just more prevailent in the recognised ones.... i agree with you taffy problem with the terrier type breeding the size is against them a first cross kerry/greyhound would probably throw too small and a 3/4 cross would still be a touch on the small side after that ur almost losing all the original gameness u require to make a consistent allrounder..... Know of a bloke .Who has a smashing Saluki bitch (90% saluki anyway).The most foxes Ive seen her take in a single night was 6 she has a bit of trouble killing them so she is generaly ran doubled up (a good bitch to enter a pup with for obvious reasons)She will kill them but can take a little longer than is fair.She has taken quite a lot of punishment in her time but she doesnt even show a sign of chucking the towel in.IMHO like most game dogs her temperament is excellent. again one offs..to consistantly breed gameness is what this threads about not one in a hundred dogs,once the game one in a million dog is lost so is its gameness,as theese never go on to produce dogs as game... also different people have different opinions of gameness,the kind of gameness i require would make the toes curl on some of the other guys,that think they have gameness theres a difference in catching 10 foxes a season to 70-+ when i was younger me and a mate used to take in exess of 150 foxes a season,theres only a certain type of canine that can throw this into breeding,pure greyhounds,salukis and some of the other commonly used breeds dont cut it,collies being some of em,and i mean consistently guys.... Quote Link to post
kiwi 4 Posted March 14, 2006 Report Share Posted March 14, 2006 don't use the word game really myself as the word in dogdom usally goes with the fighting breeds, we just call them 'hard'. and my choice is a good lab or german wirehair, the lab being my choice of breed to get my pigdogs off, airedales in my experience are born hard. also had a curly coated retrevier when i was a kid that would take on anything. the wirehair is my pick as a purebred for hunting in this country,nz. Quote Link to post
Guest jrearthdog1 Posted March 14, 2006 Report Share Posted March 14, 2006 Taffy, a mate of mine who comes over to train a few times a year has a mate that keeps Kerry Blues...he said they are quite "up for it", but they havent been tested to the best of my knowledge?.. As for Airedales,...i dont rate them as a breed in a whole...not the ones over here anyway,...if you ask me, a dog that is supposed to be a terrier, but weighs in between 45-75lbs, they shouldnt be baying at much...but guys that use them on Pigs and the like, they show pictures of three Airedales baying at pigs...we have a Staff, and when we took him to OK, he held a 120lb Pig, the first he ever saw,...he only weighs 27lbs when he is fit!!!... Airedales are hunted like hounds over here...but they DONT have the scenting ability of a hound, and they dont have the bottle of a Bull dog...i dont rate them, but there just not my cup of tea thats all...im sure people wouldnt keep them if they was crap, so there must be a good reason that lads run them...i just dont like them. Kye.. PS...Taffy, i tried to call sunday, but it was engaged mate...maybe give you a call this weekend?.. kye the 2 times you have said things about airedales you have talked of the pics that you have seen but i dont think you have talked to the people that owned the dogs to find out what happened after the pics where taken, the airedale is not just a bayer as you believe he thinks and spares and waits for the right time to strike and then go,s in with bone crushing power he is also run with with hounds out there as he will be the first to strike he is a good all round terrier that will do every thing from hunting game to killing the game ,i think the one thing that you said that was right was you dont like them take care Ian Quote Link to post
Kye 77 Posted March 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2006 Hi Ian,.. All i know is that IF they was like a proper terrier, you wouldnt be able to hunt them on Mtn Lion and bear...you couldnt hunt a 50lb Lakeland or Patterdale on bear or lion,...they would just go in for a hold and get killed.. Just like on a VERY well known Airedale terrier breeders site, in AZ...theres a picture of TWO of them baying at a badger that cant weigh more than 25lbs...maybe if the Airedale Terrier wasnt called a terrier, i would like it more!?...maybe a better word class for them would be "A hard hound"??? Im sure they will take a hold of pigs, but so will Collies, Labrodors and most Hounds...its a fact that they dont have the nose of a Hound,...and they 'aint as good at fixing a wild pig as a Bull type dog,...so, to me, they are like a "Jack of all trades" type dog...i hear that they are very good as trap line dogs...but again, they bay at stuff in the traps...i know of 15-20lb digging terriers that dont bay at anything...and thats BELOW ground, on game twice the size of the dog, so why a Airedale that weighs 60lbs should bay at a 30lb Coyote in a trap is beyond me mate?.. Ian, you obviously like the breed, and i REALY like the look of them!,...if they do a job for you mate, then thats great, i hope you continue to have sport with your chosen breed.. But i cant think why anyone would use them for a Lurcher type breeding?...not when there are some good Bull types available etc...im sure they could add nose and coat to a Lurcher, that Bull couldnt, but if you use the right Bull, cold dont affect them much...come to think of it, nothing bothers the right Bull blood!..lol. As for lurchers in America...there is a reason that Bull hybrids are NOT popular over here, but i think, IMO, that if you added the right Bull, to the right "Gear" being used over here, you would have a GREAT hunting/coursing type dog... All the best,.. Jay... Quote Link to post
Guest tossa Posted March 14, 2006 Report Share Posted March 14, 2006 The lads on here that know a bit about bulls will tell you & im not defending dog fighting in any way, but its fact that a dog was matched against a heavier dog to test its gameness this was or is called the game test .bull types are classed as the gamest breed with wheatons & some of the larger terrier but i dont think you can get a much gamer dog pound for pound than a well bread game or hard earth dog whether its patt ,lakey,bedlington whatever ...but this dog is tested in the dark under ground ,in its enemies back yard ,in a very confined space often it is out wieghed & this can last for the best part of a day so surely the terriers that we dig too have to be classed as some of the gamest dogs going about . IMHO I dont think a pointer cross or pure greyhound could be classed as game do you think they would be as keen to work a fox as a good terrier is if there enemy matched them pound for pound in other words would they work foxes if they wieghed 50-70lb? matching a dog against a heavier dog is NOT game testing a dog a terrier that is put against a wild animal trying to get away from it ,a wildlife instinct for survival is not gameness animals fighting against each other because they enjoy it is the only way to measure gameness Quote Link to post
Kane 2 Posted March 15, 2006 Report Share Posted March 15, 2006 ..... again one offs..to consistantly breed gameness is what this threads about not one in a hundred dogs,once the game one in a million dog is lost so is its gameness,as theese never go on to produce dogs as game... a season to 70-+ when i was younger me and a mate used to take in exess of 150 foxes a season,theres only a certain type of canine that can throw this into breeding,pure greyhounds,salukis and some of the other commonly used breeds dont cut it,collies being some of em,and i mean consistently guys.... The saluki bitch has taken close to a hundred in a season I would imagine very few salukis have been tested for fox killing ability or gameness mainly being used for filling the freezer or coursing.3 or 4 foxes a night wouldnt be a problem in my area if you put a bit of effort in. Quote Link to post
Guest jrearthdog1 Posted March 15, 2006 Report Share Posted March 15, 2006 Hi Ian,.. All i know is that IF they was like a proper terrier, you wouldnt be able to hunt them on Mtn Lion and bear...you couldnt hunt a 50lb Lakeland or Patterdale on bear or lion,...they would just go in for a hold and get killed.. Just like on a VERY well known Airedale terrier breeders site, in AZ...theres a picture of TWO of them baying at a badger that cant weigh more than 25lbs...maybe if the Airedale Terrier wasnt called a terrier, i would like it more!?...maybe a better word class for them would be "A hard hound"??? Im sure they will take a hold of pigs, but so will Collies, Labrodors and most Hounds...its a fact that they dont have the nose of a Hound,...and they 'aint as good at fixing a wild pig as a Bull type dog,...so, to me, they are like a "Jack of all trades" type dog...i hear that they are very good as trap line dogs...but again, they bay at stuff in the traps...i know of 15-20lb digging terriers that dont bay at anything...and thats BELOW ground, on game twice the size of the dog, so why a Airedale that weighs 60lbs should bay at a 30lb Coyote in a trap is beyond me mate?.. Ian, you obviously like the breed, and i REALY like the look of them!,...if they do a job for you mate, then thats great, i hope you continue to have sport with your chosen breed.. But i cant think why anyone would use them for a Lurcher type breeding?...not when there are some good Bull types available etc...im sure they could add nose and coat to a Lurcher, that Bull couldnt, but if you use the right Bull, cold dont affect them much...come to think of it, nothing bothers the right Bull blood!..lol. As for lurchers in America...there is a reason that Bull hybrids are NOT popular over here, but i think, IMO, that if you added the right Bull, to the right "Gear" being used over here, you would have a GREAT hunting/coursing type dog... All the best,.. Jay... kye no dog with any sence will go in on a lion or bear i have 2 times in canada had my jr's treed bear they all stayed a distance away as they new they where out classed the pic your talking about is on matt thoms site phone him and ask him if they held the badger ,when you talk of dogs working pigs i would say that any of the smaller breeds would be better like bulls or jadgs as they can move out of the way sooner than a larger dog ,also this is how airedale bay at coyote kye i have hunted earthdogs for years and they are my first love the airedale takes a close second i hope to never be without them both, as for the lurcher i am doing this breeding to hopefully get a lurcher with the good bones head feet and nose of the airedale so i can run the lurcher with the airedales and i have said that i will do an other breeding to put bull in to see which will work best for me ,i have 2 bull x's now and they are great but not the right dog to run with the airedales and i think the same as you i would think the bull would add something good to the lurchers out there i believe earthdogs are the gamest breeds size for size take care Ian Quote Link to post
Guest tossa Posted March 15, 2006 Report Share Posted March 15, 2006 The lads on here that know a bit about bulls will tell you & im not defending dog fighting in any way, but its fact that a dog was matched against a heavier dog to test its gameness this was or is called the game test . bull types are classed as the gamest breed with wheatons & some of the larger terrier but i dont think you can get a much gamer dog pound for pound than a well bread game or hard earth dog whether its patt ,lakey,bedlington whatever ...but this dog is tested in the dark under ground ,in its enemies back yard ,in a very confined space often it is out wieghed & this can last for the best part of a day so surely the terriers that we dig too have to be classed as some of the gamest dogs going about . IMHO I dont think a pointer cross or pure greyhound could be classed as game do you think they would be as keen to work a fox as a good terrier is if there enemy matched them pound for pound in other words would they work foxes if they wieghed 50-70lb? matching a dog against a heavier dog is NOT game testing a dog a terrier that is put against a wild animal trying to get away from it ,a wildlife instinct for survival is not gameness animals fighting against each other because they enjoy it is the only way to measure gameness Tossa ask someone who is in the know or do a little research on the subject about game testing a a bull dog ....it is not the prey that is being questioned for gameness so i dont see where you are coming from, wild animals do not fight cause they enjoy it they fight for survival whether it be to mate to feed or to gain terrotiry ..the point I was trying to make was gameness is measured when something is tested when it is getting beat when the odds are stacked against it but it still wants to take the fight to its enemy that is why i still think a good game working terrier is up there with the gamest dogs around mik i do not want to get into an arguement over this subject, but i have done research into gameness of bulldogs even as far as dead game !!!!!!! with wild animals its a case of fight or flight you can not call a terrier game as its opponent would rather flee than be injured a natural instinct for a wild animal i am not saying a terrier is not hard, see a lakeland kill foxes regularly and take stick doing it but even the owner would tell you thats not gameness i think our wires got crossed perhaps i never explained myself properly Quote Link to post
Kye 77 Posted March 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2006 Hi Ian,.. Im NO exspert on ANY form of hunting mate, and im sure i have got the wrong end of the stick regarding the Airedale mate,... Keep us posted about your dogs, its always interesting to hear of peoples different breeding programs... I wish you well with the project, and safe hunting! All the best,, Kye.. Quote Link to post
Guest jrearthdog1 Posted March 15, 2006 Report Share Posted March 15, 2006 Hi Ian,.. Im NO exspert on ANY form of hunting mate, and im sure i have got the wrong end of the stick regarding the Airedale mate,... Keep us posted about your dogs, its always interesting to hear of peoples different breeding programs... I wish you well with the project, and safe hunting! All the best,, Kye.. good hunting to you also kye and next time you see doug say hi from me take care Ian Quote Link to post
Guest freestate hunter 2 Posted March 16, 2006 Report Share Posted March 16, 2006 apart from the bull x and wheaten x lurchers the irish terrier lurchers have a big heart very game. Quote Link to post
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