Guest BORDERFOX Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 WHAT IM SAYING IS I BELIEVE THERE ARE VERY FEW ALL ROUND LURCHERS OUT THERE....... AS OPPOSED TO THOSE MERELY LABELLED ALL ROUNDERS. If a dog takes deer , charlies hares et all on the lamp, it isnt a n all rounder but a damm good lamp dog, and if a quality coursing dog able to take 3/4/5 on good land is able to lamp 20 rabbits is that an all rounder. I dont think so. IMHO an allrounder shouldnt just take quarry well but should excel at at least 2 disciplines in order to merit such a tag, who can honestly say that their fox destroying bull x is as equal to a daytime hare as it is on illuminated vulpines? not an occasional kickup or a 1 outta 2 runs but REGULARLY taking daytime hares. On the flipside can a saluki blood owner say his matchdog hammers into old red on the lamp? Horses for courses I know , but 1 swallow deffo doesnt make a summer and how many times have you seen pups out of all round parents?, if a dog takes 5 foxes in its life is it a fox dog? NO. if a dog takes 3 daytime hare a season is it a hare dog? No. Consistency is the key word and the proof of the pudding is in the eating, Everyone has different benchmarks for thier tykes and have varying degrees of keeness for each respective quarry, but not many broaden their palates on other species instead of allowing their dogs more scope at various fauna, its sticking to what they like. which is all well and good but advertising pups as prospective all rounders because their dog took a fox one night isnt misleading , but doing the pups no favours what so ever. Genetically and mentally , different crosses are designed for a particular quarry. I believe few first crosses will make all rounders due to their breeding, Its the next step, The 3/4 or outcross in which lies the potential. If you owned a half bull grey , you wouldnt expect it to trouble day hares, and if you owned a half sal grey , youd be forgiven for not making a dent on the local fox culture. But fused together......Would you get the best of both worlds or simply a jack of all trades and master of none? Give your dogs a look, are they a real animal on one species but nothing special on anything else? if so , be proud for they are the equal of every other lurcher in the country, If you can honestly say your dog can live with the coursing dogs and the bull platoon, or the deer runners , the ferreters or even the rabbit lampers , then yours is a dog apart. If not in a million. keep it real guys. Quote Link to post
Guest nastybilly Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 a good post borderfox..i used to think i had one of the mythical all rounders hed hunt up rabbits and mark for ferreting,hed lamp, and take deer or fox, hed take day time hares, hed even work to the gun and lift feather when he got the chance, there the pluses,now the negatives. he wouldnt go into water to retreive in fact he was never the best retreiver but he brought them close enough,so can i call him an all rounder"no"..lol..but i think hes as close as i'll ever come Quote Link to post
Guest CharlieC Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 Nasty youre too modest mate I think your auld dog was easily one of the best all rounders Ive seen, he took fur, feather, worked with ferrets, made lamping look easy, killed deer, took foxes, marked, hunted, coursed, there wasnt really much that dog didnt do mate, he had a unique style of hunting that was really good to watch and the bond use had together was great to see. He has left a legacy behind him, he was also very handy at lining bitches and maybe one day youll have another his equal, he certainly was a fantastic dog to have around. As you know I rated his litter sister very highly as well, she was an excellent hunting and coursing dog in her day as well, I think a few outstanding dogs will come back out of this bloodline at some point in the future, its just a case of getting the right cross to click with them and picking the right pup and making a really special bond with it. Anyway, Heres to the auld fella, filled the freezer full many times over, a good dog if ever I saw one Quote Link to post
Guest LEARNER Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 ITS A CATCH 22 QUEASTION, ITS LIKE SAYING A DOG AS TO CATCH , LETS SAY 200 HARES , 200 FOX, 200 DEER, 2OOO RABBITS, THEN HAVE TO DO OTHER FEATS , LIKE MARKING, RETRIEVING LIVE TO HAND, BE STEADY IN ALL SITUATIONS, HAVE STAMINA, JUMP, SWIM, AND SO ON, NOW I,VE AND I BET OTHERS, IN THIER LIFE TIME ,HAVE MET PEOPLE WITH WHAT THEY WOULD SAY HAVE ALROUNDERS, BUT THEN DIFFERANT AREA,S CAN MAKE OR HELP A DOG TO BE A ALROUNDER, ITS IF THE AREA YOU WORK HAS PLENTY OFF RABBITS , HARES , AND SAY DEER , BUT A SCARCITY OF FOX, THEN ITS HARD FOR SUCH A PERSON ,TO RUN HIS DOG ,TO THE FULL POTENTIAL , REGARDING THE FOX, AND SO ON, AND SO ON , NOW IF A LURCHER DOES TAKE ALL GAME ,THEN IN MY BOOK ,IT COULD BE A ALROUNDER, BUT IF IT AS TO BE ABLE TO TAKE MASSIVE AMOUNTS OFF SUCH GAME , THEN YOU MUST HAVE THE LAND FOR THAT TO BE A VIABILITY, I WOULD BET MY LIFE ,SOME WHERE THERE IS A LAD AND HIS DOG ,THAT CAN BE EXCELLENT IN CATCHING GAME WHATS AVAILABLE ON HIS LAND ,AND IF HAD THE MONEY AND TIME TO TRAVEL, COULD CATCH GAME JUST HAS WELL, THATS NOT PRESENT ON HIS PATCH. CATCH 22. Quote Link to post
Guest mansbestfriend Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 if your dog catches what it runs and your happy and works with the ferrets.And so on or does what you want it to do does it really mater if you call it an allrounder.And if your dog works well for you and catches its quarry.Then its your allrounder. happy hunting lads Quote Link to post
J Darcy 5,871 Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 i think the question needs to be asked: should an "allrounder EXCEL at the tasks or just be able to perform them? IMHO, after serious thought, i dobt if there are any lurchers out there that could EXCEL at every discipline.. Im talking daytime fox, deer, hare rabbit in multiples...and that is the test>>>multiples quite alot of dogs will take a singleton, but give it another, then another...see how good it is then??.. could you get a dog regularly taking 3/3 brown hares and expect it to work with the ferrets? It can happen, of course, but will it sit, stay. lie, retreive...ANd kill fox and deer up to fallow size?..there are so many variables, that hard and fast answers are very hard to nail down...i think that EVERY lurcher has its flaw...but thats JMHO.... good hunting guys...JD Quote Link to post
Guest Ash Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 To ME BF an alround is what your trying to rant about a dog that will work well at most disaplines. He might never reach the acolade as a perfect hare dog or fox killing machine or for that mater a 50 a night lamp dog on rabbits but he will do every thing ask of him well. It is sad but most dogs that might make the grade will never get the chance as most of there hunting is limited to creeping about with a light and steeling the odd run at sumthing. :whistle: Quote Link to post
bolio 51 Posted March 19, 2005 Report Share Posted March 19, 2005 I don't think we can expect any dog to be top class in every sphere of activity. After all, Daly Thompson could'nt live with Alan Wells over 100 mtrs or Seb Coe over a mile. He could'nt long jump like Carl Lewis or shot putt like Geoff Capes, but who would say he was'nt the best ALROUNDER on the planet at the time? Quote Link to post
Guest trev Posted March 19, 2005 Report Share Posted March 19, 2005 Who actually uses there dog for all types of game??? I mean who in this day and age has a dog that they would expect to run rabbits both day and night, work with nets and ferrets, take fox by day and night, run deer, take feathered game be it shot or just using it to flush game etc. etc, the list of a complete allrounder is a long one. My own dogs would have to be somewhat of an all round type of lurcher, by this i mean they would need to be able to take all the things i want them to. I have loads of fox and deer in my area and these would be my main quarry, theres also plenty of hares and a half decent no. of rabbits, most of the rabbiting i do is with the aid of a lamp so my dogs wouldnt have to be the perfect ferreting companion. Now they wouldnt be the complete allrounder but they certainly would be capable of holding thier own with all of the above mentioned quarys. I think in this day and age and with the amount of differnt crosses that are being specificaly bred for differnt purposes, the saluki cross for hares, the bullx for foxes etc. the allround type lurcher is no longer needed, people have a specific type and cross for an individual job, some types excell were others would slack. Aslong as your happy with what you have and does all thats asked of it what more do you need?? My own dogs suit me, they might not suit others, they certainly arent perfect and they arent 100% at everything they do, they excell better at species of game over others but they are what i want and i wouldnt change them for the world. Quote Link to post
IanB 0 Posted March 19, 2005 Report Share Posted March 19, 2005 My own dogs suit me, they might not suit others, they certainly arent perfect and they arent 100% at everything they do, they excell better at species of game over others but they are what i want and i wouldnt change them for the world. Same here trev, mine aren't the best by a long shot, but they keep me happy, thats what counts... Quote Link to post
Guest reload Posted March 19, 2005 Report Share Posted March 19, 2005 A bit of everything and I am happy!! Superb at every part of lurcherwork is a bit much aint it!!?? Surly one in 10,0000 or maybe even a mythical beast!! Problem with lurchers we aint talking a standard type......it can be allsorts chucked in which make certain tasks easier for the dog but a draw back in other!! Classic debate.......will go on and on and on and on............and never a conclusion Quote Link to post
Guest CharlieC Posted March 19, 2005 Report Share Posted March 19, 2005 For me an allrounder is a dog that can be taken anywjere and run on any quarry at any time of day or year and it will give its best and perform well. Theres not much more you can ask of a dog really. To put up its best show and not embarrass you too much whenever your out, whatever your after and wherever you go. Ive seen a few dogs that fulfill this criteria, so I consider myself very fortunate indeed cos it is very rare to get a dog which can do a bit of everything and do it really well and consistently Quote Link to post
Guest lifeisloud Posted March 26, 2005 Report Share Posted March 26, 2005 at the end of the day who cares. if ur dog onle catches one of the quary we are after then surly it is a good dog. just except a dog for what it is and dont worry about what different species it is after. enjoy the hunt of even a rabbit by a mediocar dog for what it is. Quote Link to post
Guest lurcherlad Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 any pics of so callled 'all rounders' Quote Link to post
Guest Leveller Posted September 8, 2008 Report Share Posted September 8, 2008 Intresting thread it will be intresting to see how the thread develops Quote Link to post
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