damashaman 1 Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Patterdale enthusiasts, purists say that patts never had bull blood in them. I think they are wrong. Throuought the history of working terriers, bull blood was invariably used to spice things up a bit. Ken Gould in more recent times did it with his strain of Russells, not to mention the Sparticus Fells as well. Sparrow, an old terrier authority suggested using it also. My thoughts are this; which came first the chicken or the egg? So many APBTs I have been around remind me so much of working terriers, and vice versa. When the rat pits were in there hey day, all sorts of bull and terrier percentages were experimented with, until a stamp was achived, which led directly to the things we have today. Even the APBT can thank a good percentage of game terrier in it's paternity. Other things overlooked in Patterdale history is the influence from Bedlington terriers. It was often said that beddys were commonly used to improve the gameness in Fell and lakeland types. Now were not talking about those little poodle cross breeds seen in K.C. shows, we are talking about the original fire breathing beddys of the north east that are sadly no longer with us, or are just remnants of in the modern Patterdale and fell terrier. It seems to me that these days people (apart from some Plummer Terrier people) have disregarded to a great extent this method of improvement. Maybe now people simply could not afford to throw away so many surplus pups on the lead up to dilution? Nor justify the cross, after all it takes a heck of a lot of diluting to get things usefull. Getting them, or breeding from them already done is very useful, as it is a quick fix and a short cut to get the desired results. keeping them small enough is the prime requirement, that is why small 35lb pit dogs are way more useable in such blendings, as pedigree staffords, as they invariably are too stocky and heavy. This methodology is good to improve most terriers, it is also common knowledge that working wheatons have a good deal of bull blood added to them in the past. They also did it to improve the greyhound many moons ago. The Bull blood is probably the most versitile type on the planet, we have a lot to thank it for. Quote Link to post
the_stig 6,614 Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 ken gould put bull into his russells and black stuff 40 years ago Quote Link to post
damashaman 1 Posted May 30, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Yeah a know, like a said innit Quote Link to post
the_stig 6,614 Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Yeah a know, like a said innityou said iin more recent times ? like i said its 40 plus year ago Quote Link to post
waz77 15 Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Gouldie still does put bull into his terriers Quote Link to post
damashaman 1 Posted May 30, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 more recent times than sparrow, is recent history! Quote Link to post
the_stig 6,614 Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Gouldie still does put bull into his terriers Quote Link to post
the_stig 6,614 Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 more recent times than sparrow, is recent history! o.k. fair comment 40 year ago was fairly recent like recent times when harold wilson was priminister and we could all dig the black n white fella Quote Link to post
earth&hounds 94 Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 more recent times than sparrow, is recent history! o.k. fair comment 40 year ago was fairly recent like recent times when harold wilson was priminister and we could all dig the black n white fella WELL SAID THAT MAN BIT OV BULL IN MOST DOGS IF THE TRUTH IS KNOWN Quote Link to post
damashaman 1 Posted May 30, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 TRUE, more like a LOT of bull in most dogs, albeit scaled down. And for the real stuff, it's just scaled up! Quote Link to post
twotone 6 Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 "Other things overlooked in Patterdale history is the influence from Bedlington terriers. It was often said that beddys were commonly used to improve the gameness in Fell and lakeland types. Now were not talking about those little poodle cross breeds seen in K.C. shows, we are talking about the original fire breathing beddys of the north east that are sadly no longer with us, or are just remnants of in the modern Patterdale and fell terrier." Good to see some recognition for the bedlington sadly those dogs no longer common place but with time, selective breeding and if you look in the right place you may still find some who share those bygone qualities. 2tone Quote Link to post
damashaman 1 Posted May 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2008 Thanks twotone, the Border terrier in the Patterdale's background is also overlooked too. Quote Link to post
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