Ferreting dog.

[Loton Moocher 1,252]

2 hours ago, Neal said:

Good idea: that might stop my frilly thong from showing too.

I bet. Black has the same trouble with some his frocks

[Moocher71 4,044]

On 14/05/2020 at 07:07, Aussie Whip said:

If they are like the working ones here you have to keep them busy.They aren't suitable for town life,if on a chain for any time they bark constantly.They have endless stamina and are tough and healthy.If you have the dog with you mostly she maybe ok.I'm talking pure working kelpies not pet type.

I'd like a cattle dog but don't see many pure acd here in uk . 

[Aussie Whip 3,822]

11 minutes ago, Moocher71 said:

I'd like a cattle dog but don't see many pure acd here in uk . 

There are plenty over here,mainly used as guards for utes,not many working types unless you go out west.There are some really nice, hard looking cattle dog about but a lot have been ruined by show people.They are extremely loyal and protective of kids and elderly people but you don't try to pat them if they don't know you.

[Neal 1,784]

4 hours ago, Aussie Whip said:

There are plenty over here,mainly used as guards for utes,not many working types unless you go out west.There are some really nice, hard looking cattle dog about but a lot have been ruined by show people.They are extremely loyal and protective of kids and elderly people but you don't try to pat them if they don't know you.

I've had a few people backing away when I've told them mine are Australian kelpies. "Do you mean Australian Cattle Dogs?" they ask. "Similar," I reply, "but friendly."

[Aussie Whip 3,822]

8 hours ago, Neal said:

I've had a few people backing away when I've told them mine are Australian kelpies. "Do you mean Australian Cattle Dogs?" they ask. "Similar," I reply, "but friendly."

Most of the kelpies I've seen are friendly dogs,workers or not but my mother had a red kelpie as a kid that was so protective of her it was safe to leave her playing in the front yard as no one could get past the dog and it never left her side.

[Neal 1,784]

I'm not sure why the two breeds, which are so similar in some ways, should be so different in that respect, maybe there's more dingo...or a difference in the initial collies used? Like you said though, not all are friendly but I think a lot of British people expect them to be overly protective gurad dog types. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want to be a burglar getting into my house and being faced with Noggin! He's friendly but only if you're expected.

He's now my twelve year old son's dog and they get on like only a boy and his dog can, curling up in the dog bed together etc. Sometimes he even asks to sleep downstairs so that he can sleep on the floor with him.

To Moocher71: I saw an edvert on the internet recently (possibly preloved or somewhere similar) for a kelpie x collie x heeler in the UK. I think it was about six months old.

[Aussie Whip 3,822]

4 hours ago, Neal said:

maybe there's more dingo..

What I've been led to believe is the ACD's are about 1/4 dingo and most kelpie lines have none or very little.I think most kelpies, being so loyal would protect their owners,even my whippet lurchers will if they feel I'm in danger.About dingo blood,I've seen working kelpies that look half dingo with broad heads and the dingo eyes,but in the bush here they very well could have been sired by a wild dog.

[Neal 1,784]

4 hours ago, Aussie Whip said:

What I've been led to believe is the ACD's are about 1/4 dingo and most kelpie lines have none or very little.I think most kelpies, being so loyal would protect their owners,even my whippet lurchers will if they feel I'm in danger.About dingo blood,I've seen working kelpies that look half dingo with broad heads and the dingo eyes,but in the bush here they very well could have been sired by a wild dog.

There was a genetic study done recently which claimed there was no dingo blood in kelpies. However, there was one done a few years previously which claimed there was about 4%. I read a book about the similarities between wolves and dogs which was written by a human geneticist. He said the problem with genetic tests is that they don't all necessarily give you the same results. Some only show information going back through either the male or female line. In the latter case you'd miss out on anything, for example, passed on by mitochondrial dna. As most successful kelpie studs tend to have a particularly strong bitch line then this could miss out vital evidence. If there'd been no Biddy's daughter, Kelpie's daughter, Kelpie or Black Bess then there'd have been no kelpie in the first place.

Before the advent of genetic testing there was no way of knowing just by word of mouth as (according to the Tony Parson's book) some who used dingo blood denied it as dingoes were not held in high regard by a lot of people. Conversely, some people took the opposite tack and claimed dingo blood when there wasn't any. I suppose the latter was because some liked the notoriety. I guess it's a bit like how, back in the 80s and 90s, anybody with a dog descended from Richard Jones claimed it was a beardie cross and left out the border and I've known people to advertise dogs from Dave Sleight as kelpie crosses and, once again, to ignore the fact that they had just as much border collie. Another example is how people over claim collie blood just because a dog is merle when there could be virtually none in it. My brother once had a lovely lurcher called Flint who looked to all intents and purposes like a large solid merle collie x whippet but he was only about 1/8 or 1/16 collie and the rest was, I think, whippet, greyhound and terrier. I've lost count of the number of "collie lurchers" I've seen which were basically sight hounds but a distant ancestor was a merle collie.

Edited to add: those are my favourite type of kelpie i.e. the dingo looking ones with a short tight coat and a large head and dingo eyes. I see more and more now which look like black and tan smooth coated collies...not that there's anything wrong with that!

Edited September 12, 2020 by Neal

[Aussie Whip 3,822]

8 hours ago, Neal said:

the dingo looking ones with a short tight coat and a large head and dingo eyes.

I forgot to mention the tight coat,these crosses almost look like they have some type of bull blood,strange how the coat is much shorter than either parent.With the DNA I find it strange how two pups from the same litter/parents have different % of the breeds in them,some may not have any % of a certain ancestor in them.I thought they would have the same percentage.Even though not a fan of dingo's,these crosses do appeal to me too.

 

[troyboy17 631]

Does anyone breed first cross collie whippets the best rabbiting dog I have ever had

[Neal 1,784]

I've only ever had one. She was born back in the early 90s by a racing whippet breeder. She was also a farmer but she didn't like the collie temperament so she used her whippet to help with rounding up the sheep! She said it wasn't perfect by any means and obviously didn't have an outrun like a sheepdog but she worked it by shouting out the name of things and people in the field and it would run towards them e.g. "Tree! Gate!" She decided she wanted one more collie-like so mated a 3/4 whippet 1/4 greyhound to a stud dog of David Hancock's called Tory which was sired by Richard Jones out of Katie the "Dartmoor" collie, so therefore 3/4 border collie 1/4 beardie.

Apologies if I'm repeating myself but I'm sure I've written that bit recently...I hope it's not earlier on in this thread...senior moment! 

[troyboy17 631]

U right as much as u like I'm really interested 

[Neal 1,784]

If you use the search button, I'm pretty sure there have been a few collie x whippet threads on here in the past. Having said that, most go along the route of...I'm thinking of getting one, what does everybody think? Followed by people who've never met one saying they're crap and you can only catch with greyhound blood...or a pure whippet. From what I gather, some can be simply not right for what they're being used for whereas others are heralded as the best dog they've ever had by others.

[troyboy17 631]

This one the best I have ever owned 

[troyboy17 631]

Why don't people breed the collie whippet u here there loads o Bedlington x whippets being sold can't get enough of them  but the collie whippet a little bit bigger mine was 22tts more obedient specially for ferreting