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Failed with the mullet ,but!


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Oh come on! You are a serial vintage tackle tart and I am not taking the blame for your most recent 'fix'.

I have never seen a rod with so many intermediate whippings. I think the person who restored the rod must have spent a long, long time on the project as those little whippings are in my experience harder than whipping a rod ring on. Having said that; it looks like a lovely rod and at the right price too!

All you need now is a suitable reel :whistling:

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6 hours ago, Nicepix said:

Oh come on! You are a serial vintage tackle tart and I am not taking the blame for your most recent 'fix'.

I have never seen a rod with so many intermediate whippings. I think the person who restored the rod must have spent a long, long time on the project as those little whippings are in my experience harder than whipping a rod ring on. Having said that; it looks like a lovely rod and at the right price too!

All you need now is a suitable reel :whistling:

Perhaps serenipitous mention of your Monarch is more accurate than the term blame?

I posted on a fishing forum asking for any information and the plethora of whippings certainly caused comment.  If I remember ,you said your Marco was whipped in green. The rings ,ferrule and butt joint on my rod are whipped in green and might be original ,though it appears almost black under the varnish. So maybe the name Capella is genuine after all ; rather than ,as I first thought , a fiction of the previous owner?. All the fancy whipping is in burgundy  so as you say ,probably a bit of a project for someone.

The varnish is a bit wrinkly in places  but there is a good coat of it.

As to a reel. I have a tatty a half bail Mitchell and equally uncollectable Ambidex ; either would be fairly contempory fitments but I fancy an excuse to use this again

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30lb braid should do. Just have to pray the vintage repairs hold out if I hook something!

 

 

Edited by comanche
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OK, I accept your 'apology' ? And I promise that I won't mention my mint Chapmans 500 light Avon rod to prevent any further misunderstanding 

So here is a mullet that is of course the subject of this thread.................

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:whistling:

I read on the Traditional Fisherman site that all Marco rods were originally whipped in dark green and on the old rod I have this appears to be the same although they have severely darkened with age and varnish. I had some green fly-tying floss, but it wasn't strong enough so I opted for black and after a coat of epoxy and three thin coats of varnish it would take a good eye to tell the difference. And it isn't a museum piece anyway so what does it matter?

The old Nottingham reel would be a perfect match and whilst braid would be a tad abrasive when weight up in context of the amount of times the rod will get used under load I can't see it being a major problem. I'm opting for braid too and in the first instance using the Okuma Trent centrepin I have already for catfish. In time I will probably get a 5" Alvey. I wouldn't like to try and stop a large catfish just relying on with thumb pressure  again ?

If you are doubting the strength of the whippings just coat them with Araldite using a small plastic spatula. No point ending up holding just the handle with an angry pike on the other end and an empty rod laying at your side.?

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What a lovely mullet(I don't do envy ..but if I did?),and lovely rod, and  a Mitchell Match. I have a good one ready for a boot sale.  It belonged to a friend's father ,a keen matchman,who had "breathed on" it ,as they say in motorcycle tuning. Very nice but not for me.

I  did rather think the origins of the thread had been lost in a mist of nostalgic tackle talk. An acknowledgement of the past ; when millions of squirrels roamed the plains of America and there were so many trees in this country that a buffalo could go from Land's End to John O'Groats without touching the ground.

The Traditional Fisherman's site is where I asked for information on my rod. I've not been a member long enough to learn the funny hand-shake or be given a barbel -skin apron but it is wealth of information.

The Nottingham reel has history. I bought it along with a greenheart rod from a junk shop in Wick ,Sussex , 35 or more years ago. It had obviously been subject to garden shed repairs,including a foot hacked out of brass plate. I hadn't noticed when I bought it because it was attached to the rod but crudely stamped on the foot is some lettering. What looks like the word Arundel is preceeded by an initial and a my Mum's maiden name!

It is not a common name and her family did originally come from the Littlehampton,Wick and Arundel area. It's not impossible that I stumbled across a reel  that had belonged to an ancestor.  Bet he was a lot better angler than me. Though his metalwork is definitely worse than mine.

 

Edited by comanche
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So, you are one of the hallowed 500? People who can talk of bending cane without visions of Professor Jimmy Edwards coming to mind. Forums like that are great places for novices like me to glean information, but I prefer to do it without having to bare my breast and recite chapters from The Treatise in a darkened room.

If I hadn't already got two 440A reels I would have offered a swap for my Adcocks Stanton ?

The Nottingham reel that you have has possibly I think been repaired by means of those brass panels holding the wooden spool together. And the reel foot adaptation is quite common given the changing fashions of reel attachment over the generations. But that doesn't matter one jot given the likelihood of it having a family  history. Possibly a search on Free BMD and / or the Mormons genealogy site Family Search might tie a few ends together.  I bought a usable, but hand painted Speedia from a nice lady over here. It was her Father's and she also had two wooden Nottingham reels in quite poor shape. She offered me those reels for nothing, but I suggested that they would be better cleaned and mounted on a wooden base as mementoes of her Father.

Back to the Silver Monarch:

The varnish is not 100%. There are a few runs here and there, but nothing to worry about. Most of the chrome rings are slightly pitted in places, but again nothing to worry about. The parts the line will touch have been checked for grooves and polished up. I used hand cleaner on the cork and then scrubbed it with a plastic pad. And it is now good to go as the youngsters say:

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Cost; a tenner plus five teaspoons or varnish from a €9 tin, 20 cents worth of White Spirits, some fly-tying silk I had laid about and a few cotton wool buds.

<edit> Having a sneaky peek into the TTF I realise that others as well as myself made the incorrect assumption that 'Silver Monarch' identifies the rod as a salmon rod. When you look at Marco rods the names bear no resemblance to their intended purpose. The Nymph for example was advertised as a pike rod. And others have names far too many pretensions for such a low priced item of tackle. The other killer aspect to the Silver Monarch = Salmon argument is that there are details on the web of a Marco 'Silver King' (as in Tarpon) sea boat rod with exactly the same spec' as my own rod. 10 foot, double built, 2 piece. It was offered along with a Marco Nymph rod that appears even more stoutly built than the Silver King!

https://www.ukauctioneers.com/auction_catalogue.cfm?d&amp;itemID=20E9CB0FD7D62AFFDFE0FECEFF5808EBED2FAFCB&amp;auction=21ECC906D0&amp;action=3&amp;rangepage=8&amp;currentpage=1&amp;showLots=50&amp;sortBy=lotsort&amp;lotView=list&amp;imagesOnly=N

Edited by Nicepix
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Yes, I mentioned your rod on my TF site thread and someone mentioned the faux salmon connection. Marco names do seem a bit randomly applied. I believe Capella ,the name of my rod, could mean chapel ,a bright star, or unlikely for such a stout rod, a snipe.

       Looking at the rings on your Silver Monarch I am even more confident that my rod is from the same stable. I've yet to find an image of a plain "Capella" like mine ; only a few of the Capella De Luxe which has a posh ,screw reel seat looks like a  more lightweight rod.

The old Nottingham is indeed held together with thin brass plates that look as  if they came from a clock frame or lock. I added some Araldite and sawdust to the equation . In the past I have caught carp up to ten pounds and a 14 pound pike using . 

Wow,I've looked at your link. The Nymph rod is the nearest Marco rod to mine I've seen.?

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It would seem that there are at least three versions of the Capella. The standard, the De-luxe and the Glass Capella which would have been towards the end of the company's business. I think that hollow fibreglass rods became more popular in the early 60's onwards. Marco seemed to make variations on a theme and during the period of the cane Capellas they also made rods actually branded for the species of which they were intended; Carp. These would have piggy-backed Walker's successes with his own type of cane rods that came into prominence  in the 1950's. So, I would think that there is a very good chance that your rod would not be too dissimilar to a Marco Carp models.

https://vintagecarpfishingtackle.com/rods/marco-elasticane-split-cane-standard-carp-vintage-carp-fishing-rod-detail

https://www.mullocksauctions.co.uk/lot-725738-fine_marco_standard_carp_rod_10ft_2pc.html

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2 hours ago, Nicepix said:

It would seem that there are at least three versions of the Capella. The standard, the De-luxe and the Glass Capella which would have been towards the end of the company's business. I think that hollow fibreglass rods became more popular in the early 60's onwards. Marco seemed to make variations on a theme and during the period of the cane Capellas they also made rods actually branded for the species of which they were intended; Carp. These would have piggy-backed Walker's successes with his own type of cane rods that came into prominence  in the 1950's. So, I would think that there is a very good chance that your rod would not be too dissimilar to a Marco Carp models.

https://vintagecarpfishingtackle.com/rods/marco-elasticane-split-cane-standard-carp-vintage-carp-fishing-rod-detail

https://www.mullocksauctions.co.uk/lot-725738-fine_marco_standard_carp_rod_10ft_2pc.html

From the bronzy fittings and handle shape the rod predates the Walker era carp rods ,but you could be onto something. Maybe the extra whippings and general tarting-up were done by an owner riding the Mk 1V wave.

        Its one thing having the rod explode during an epic battle with a fish but  like you I didn't want to go too heavy with the test curve investigation . 3lb test curve would be erring on the conservative side.

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If it were mine and I had time on my hands I would strip the lot off right down to the bare wood and start again using the original rings if they are not grooved. Five or six rings would me take about an hour and a half to re-do, 2 hours including the lower and ferrule whippings. Then working off the photos you have you could add intermediate whippings more in style to the original. If you used epoxy resin on the rod rings you could probably get away with some of the intermediate whippings if you wanted to.

For the lower part; the Marco transfer has long gone so forget that and just replicate the Elasticane and Capella writing using a suitably fine permanent marker pen.

All in all, probably about 4 - 5 hours work (at my work rate), plus the stripping and varnishing and you would end up with a rod to be proud of. ?

(Or for £35 you could buy this)...  https://www.riverreads.co.uk/p-27025-martin-james-capella-deluxe-elasticane-rod.aspx 

Edited by Nicepix
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Well Mr. Commanche, you left it too late. As I understand it ? , the Capella De-Luxe rod is now sold to a (ahem) friend of mine :whistling: and will be posted in a week or so in order that it arrives when the, sorry, his Memsaab will be visiting family in England.

Apparently the rod is to be shipped along with an Alvey Snapper reel just like the one I was planning on getting for my old Silver Monarch rod. Quite a coincidence. So if you want any measurements or detail in order to help you restore your utility model I am sure that my friend will oblige. ?

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Excellent. I will be asking your friend ,via you of course if it is not an inconvenience , for comparisons?.

I don't think I will go down the restoration to original route. I rather like the rod as it is. It's a bit like vintage motorbikes. There are hundreds of superb restorations about but it's the old clunkers that have been kept on the road  and evolved with ingenious repairs and the "wrong " parts that I think are more interesting.  I am a Philistine? Anyway I could do a lot of work on my £5.99 rod and it would still end up only being a 40 quid rod. I may regret my stance though when reports of giant catfish falling to your Marco really does treble the price of the marque!

Do you think your friend will let you have use of the Alvey on long-term loan...?

I'm reminded of my first ever sea boat trip. One of our lot was using an Alvey which the skipper rolled his eyes at . So you can image his look of despair when I produced a crude metal centerpin and unleashed a home-made boat rod and another lad tackled up with a five foot Woolworth rod and Black Prince reel. As it was, our cobbled together tackle didn't do too badly until Barry,he of the Black Prince hooked a conger! He'd almost got it within boating range when there was a funny crunching noise and the Black Prince seized solid. All we could do was watch as the conger hung in the water while the skipper tried to hand-line it up. Unsurprisingly it bit through the line at the last minute . While we comiserated with Barry about the loss of his fish and destruction of the reel the skipper leapt on his radio to gleefully tell the other skippers about " Some xxxt with a xxxxing 3foot Woolies rod and xxxxing Black Prince losing a xxxxing 30lb conger!

 

Edited by comanche
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Yes, I am sure that my friend will oblige both of us in due course. He would have had no problem smuggling a small parcel containing the Alvey past the Memsaab; something needed to repair the mower or a filter for the van, but a five foot tube might have received more female scrutiny than was good for the recipient of the parcel.

I can understand your thoughts about keeping the rod as it is. If it ain't broke don't fix it. And, like you I have no compunctions about going off spec' if needs must. Let's hope that the Arun pike oblige the old tackle. It would be nice to see a photo of old esox alongside the cane and brass.

Two of our six man sea fishing club had those huge yellow Alveys and the other three opted for equally sized wooden Scarborough reels that had been hand crafted by colliery apprentices. My father-in-law had a similar reel that ran on the bearing taken from the hub of a bike. Given that all we caught were 3lb codling and my coming from a coarse fishing background I thought that the 50lb class solid glass Milbro Commanders and huge reels were a tad overkill. I couldn't see the point of having to wind all the way up after a bite to see whether you had anything on, so insensitive was their tackle. My preference initially was a 20lb class hollow rod and a new-fangled Mitchell mulitplier. One of my mates was huge; 6' 4" and over 25 stone and he used to give me grief about my "kid's tackle". One evening at Whitby, after fishing I challenged him to lift a gallon bucket of water off the ground and onto a chair using his sea rod outfit. If he could I bought supper. If he couldn't supper was on him. Despite his exertions, and at one point I thought he was going to have a heart attack, all he could do was skim the bucket a few inches across the ground. Cod & chips from the Magpie Cafe never tasted as good. ?

A couple of years later, before a trip to Ireland I took advantage of the newly developed Spiderwire line and downgraded my outfit to a 12lb class rod and lever drag multiplier. I was using 6 to 8oz leads and they were on 1lb - 1lb 8oz weights because of the thick cuttyhunk lines they had. Boy, did that rod bend! The pollack took lures in mid water like I'd foul-hooked a colliery lift on the descent. I had so much fun I forgot to be sea-sick.

 

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It is amazing how boat fishing has changed. I don't go boat fishing often now,mainly because of the expense and work commitments. Luckily I have a friend( actually one of the original lot who was involved in the Black Prince/ conger inaugural voyage)who arranges regular trips and his wise words of " In 20 years time are you going to look back and fondly remember the days you spent at work? Or are you going to wish you'd spent more time fishing?" tend to sway me into at least a couple of trips a year.

Like you and most people these days I've gone light; a Ron Thompson 12-25lb rod and an Abu Blue Streak bait-caster . I confess I bought it because it was the cheapest light sea rod my local shop had in stock and because the colour of the whippings  matched the reel. Obviously I really am more of a tackle tart than I thought?) Interestingly the rod was in the shop for the same price as on the internet and the reel was cheaper than on-line even though it had to be ordered in because I wanted L/H wind. Support your local dealership!

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Luckily we have a much more polite Skipper these days ; one who wouldn't bat an eye if I turned-up with a tatty cane pike rod( wouldn't want to wreck the nice Capella- too much of a tart?) and classic reel......

No ,no ,no,I must not trawl junk shops for such a tool ,or an Alvey....?. Though if I sold my hated,virtually unused and overrated John Wilson Quiver ,,,I could possibly justify it

Hopefully the Capella will appear in a photo with an Arun pike very soon ,even if it is only a jack. And I wish you luck with the catfish. 

 

 

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Wise words from your mate. I had already decided to cut back my work and spend more time fishing and camping. The recent illness has reinforced that decision.

Hopefully the Silver Monarch will be making its debut in just under three weeks time as a sleeper rod in a swim that could produce anything from barbel to mullet. ? 

Half a mackerel float / ledgered down the nearside ledge might just turn up a salty cat. ?  I don't think that the Alvey will have made an appearance by then so the Okuma Trent will be forced into action again.  In the mean time I will be returning to the river bank tomorrow in a slightly restricted capacity.

I look forward to seeing an Arun pike in due course. :thumbs:

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