Old Photo's

[darbo 4,770]

[Aussie Whip 3,609]

6 hours ago, p3d said:

Peter Hills, an 1870s Yorkshire gamekeeper (Anyones guess what is in that white terrier)

Sealyham/staff?

[p3d 878]

2 minutes ago, Aussie Whip said:

Sealyham/staff?

Could be, if you look at the dog "Tinkers Double" it has a square head like that.

[Aussie Whip 3,609]

1 minute ago, p3d said:

Could be, if you look at the dog "Tinkers Double" it has a square head like that.

It also looks English bull/Russell.I was hoping you knew.

[darbo 4,770]

[darbo 4,770]

[hoosier 58]

11 hours ago, darbo said:

I have a soft spot for scotties. Enjoy seeing historical pics of them. Doubt they were much of a working dog though 

[p3d 878]

20 hours ago, darbo said:

Two excellent photographs, the Irish terrier from 1900 could easily pass for a working dog today. Pity the show crowd destroyed them.

[Bosun11 537]

On 06/06/2019 at 16:24, p3d said:

RH,

Some early photographs with Black terriers,

Before 1930 above.

Dobson on the left.

Kendlal Otterhounds 1930

Spartacus, Great Grandson of Smithy who was born 1972 so this must late 70's , maybe 76-78

Note Gould calls them all Black Fell types.

 

 

I remember Spartacus from the mid to late 80's. Ken would peg him and his progeny out for all to see a shows.

[forest of dean redneck 10,965]

35 litters from 15 months old , so the dog was mated just into its first season of work ? 

[Mixedgrill 703]

4 minutes ago, forest of dean redneck said:

35 litters from 15 months old , so the dog was mated just into its first season of work ? 

 wonder how much ken Was charging for a service back then?  Bet he made some poppy out of his dogs

[Rabbit Hunter 6,582]

Going back to the first black dogs( as we know them).

Here’s the pedigree for Breay’s ‘Gem’, it seems she’s the first proper black to appear.

This is Gem

And then there’s Davy, a son of Gem and so the type seems to have been set. 

So is it fair to say Gem was the first proper black? 

[Glyn..... 5,197]

most black blood was bred from Tommy dobsons Choc's and he was breeding his choc's  eighty  years before Breay/Buck 

Edited June 8, 2019 by Glyn.....

[Rabbit Hunter 6,582]

Obviously all blood has to go back to something Glyn, but what was it that all of a sudden stopped the lakie and bedlington look and began to produce the blacks like Gem, Davy, Skiffle? Thats the question I’m after answering.

[Glyn..... 5,197]

your blinded by the black mate , you should be looking at Ruby's breeding   we all know people that bred just worker to worker i have mate that does it he had a choc bitch off me and couldn't work out why if he mated her to a russell he got black pups or a red he got  black pups and so on , it's easy choc is recessive dilution gene , once you mate them to any terrier carrying a black gene even if its only the nose or a few black hairs the self( all one color )  stays dominant but the recessive becomes that and you get self colored blacks  there been black about for hundreds of years, i was breeding a old book about borders and there is mention of the root stock beddy's dandys and borders coming black its all about fashion what's in vogue  also a 150 years ago dogs with red or putty's noses where class as better finders , we all know that to be true now