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11 minutes ago, Blackmag said:

I have mine round sheep while there penned up from 8 weeks same as cats any eye balling is soon sorted then I have them sat there when there loaded up for market all that running and jumping about soons gets any dogs attention but again it's soon sorted but I have found running venison regular seems to put all that training to one side if your not careful 

The venison bit seems relevant to me , had a little bitch back from a mate who used my old deer x grey to line his bitch . Had her from a pup 8 weeks , live on my own farm so she always around sheep , never battered an eyelid , used to go in with pet lambs even play on the garden with lambs and my kids . As she got older she used to come out round the ewes with my Huntaway and was always more interested in rabbiting than the sheep . At about a year old she realised the Huntaway would go up in our woods after roe and would join her ..... never bothered me until my neighbour said they had seen the pair on a roe in the neighbouring estates formal gardens , so from then decided to only let one out  at a time . Shortly after had a couple of sheep attacks from dogs , ewes pulled at behind and a couple half grown lambs with tails missing . This happened a couple of days running then nothing for a week or so , then every couple of days for about a fortnight ...... I was going nuts , out all the time checking sheep always with one or other of my dogs with me , neither of which even looked at a sheep . End of third week , got a call from the missus while i was away from the farm , she had caught my little lurcher bitch red handed chasing the sheep . Moral , no matter how good and how well trained you think your dog is never trust it completely .

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On 01/02/2019 at 15:02, Jackknife said:

Shock collar, full wack and zap..... Sorted

Backflips 

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Just now, mr powers said:

Backflips 

Prefer the 6ft leap in the air approach myself 

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7 minutes ago, Jackknife said:

Prefer the 6ft leap in the air approach myself 

Both very effective 

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Ray is right I reckon it is not nice but you have no choice but even that may not work with some like mine.  So collar is next best thing and better as you having the timing on your side. Use continuous not pulse or it might run through it. It might take a few goes some times but every time it sets off bang it won't take many goes.

In the mean time never give it the opportunity again with out a collar  be cause each time it goes it will be harder.Get a long line on. Plus a walloping after the event is not ideal and too late really
 

Edited by terryd

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46 minutes ago, terryd said:

Ray is right I reckon it is not nice but you have no choice but even that may not work with some like mine.  So collar is next best thing and better as you having the timing on your side. Use continuous not pulse or it might run through it. It might take a few goes some times but every time it sets off bang it won't take many goes.

In the mean time never give it the opportunity again with out a collar  be cause each time it goes it will be harder.Get a long line on. Plus a walloping after the event is not ideal and too late really
 

Had 1 was great wi sheep and hosses but for some reason young hiefers fresh out the shed and jumpy made him act a c**t I let him get pretty close then wallop 

The dog thought the cows had done that to him and never looked at 1 again

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Mines seen horses day in day out in a few fields I walk and paddocks I walk past yet couple days ago in the arse end of no where a horse rider showed up all was fine till the horse was put into full gallop by the rider seemed that was the dogs cue to give chase. 

Off they went over the hill and out of sight dog came back 10 mins later...... Not sure if he pulled it down or not lol as said never trust 100%

Edited by Jackknife

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Hi what cross is the dog you are having the problem with.

My mate who I go ferreting  with who is an excellent dog trainer has faced a real challenge with his first season collie bred lurcher.

It has a natural curiosity with sheep due to the collie blood just wanting to herd them.

In respect to the age of your dog it is not old enough to have reached the finished point of fully stock broken and will not for some time.

As the dog get older and sees work it will change and when the blood is running what was on appearances a stock broken dog can quickly change something I have seen first hand.

You are coming to the ideal time to get on top of this issue with lambs on the scene shortly and with the permission of the farmer take the dog to sheep with lamps and it will get taught a lesson by the ewes but strictly supervise this to prevent damage to the dog. This is something we do with every dog if possible.

We have had dogs which have despite all this preparation have chased sheep when I have said the blood is running and in this situation in conjunction and under the supervision of the farmer we take the dog to a ram.

One particular dog who was a night mare was cured in one single visit but you must supervise this or the dog can be permanently damaged the size of rams being incredible and as said all with supervision of the farmer.

My mate overdid it a lot of years ago with a particularly bad sheep chaser but it killed its spirit and it stopped chasing anything sheep or rabbit.

In respect to the shock collar they have a role to play in certain situations and if used correctly and with compassion none of this frying a dog rubbish are an excellent tool and you would be surprised how many professional dog trainers use them.

I had an issue with a lamping dog which just lost recall suddenly when missing a rabbit and hunted up. I tried everything to remedy this with no success.

I spoke to numerous professional dog trainers who all advised the shock collar because it was the only way to gain remote control of the dog in this type of situation.

I followed the advice to the letter they gave after purchasing a pac remote collar and in 5 minutes the dog was back to returning to the whistle as soon as the lamp was put out.

I used the shock twice the kit cost me over £250 but it was money well spent.

The dog lost it again 2 years later repeat process shocked once then 3 years before any problems.

They are an excellent device but get a bad name due to all this talk of frying a dog.

If you watch Ceaser Milan the American dog trainer training pit bulls to avoid rattle snakes with a shock collar something which is life threatening you will see the value and again used with compasiion.

Persevere mate and you will get there but I think one of the main issues is the age of your dog. 

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14 hours ago, budgie123 said:

Hi what cross is the dog you are having the problem with.

My mate who I go ferreting  with who is an excellent dog trainer has faced a real challenge with his first season collie bred lurcher.

It has a natural curiosity with sheep due to the collie blood just wanting to herd them.

In respect to the age of your dog it is not old enough to have reached the finished point of fully stock broken and will not for some time.

As the dog get older and sees work it will change and when the blood is running what was on appearances a stock broken dog can quickly change something I have seen first hand.

You are coming to the ideal time to get on top of this issue with lambs on the scene shortly and with the permission of the farmer take the dog to sheep with lamps and it will get taught a lesson by the ewes but strictly supervise this to prevent damage to the dog. This is something we do with every dog if possible.

We have had dogs which have despite all this preparation have chased sheep when I have said the blood is running and in this situation in conjunction and under the supervision of the farmer we take the dog to a ram.

One particular dog who was a night mare was cured in one single visit but you must supervise this or the dog can be permanently damaged the size of rams being incredible and as said all with supervision of the farmer.

My mate overdid it a lot of years ago with a particularly bad sheep chaser but it killed its spirit and it stopped chasing anything sheep or rabbit.

In respect to the shock collar they have a role to play in certain situations and if used correctly and with compassion none of this frying a dog rubbish are an excellent tool and you would be surprised how many professional dog trainers use them.

I had an issue with a lamping dog which just lost recall suddenly when missing a rabbit and hunted up. I tried everything to remedy this with no success.

I spoke to numerous professional dog trainers who all advised the shock collar because it was the only way to gain remote control of the dog in this type of situation.

I followed the advice to the letter they gave after purchasing a pac remote collar and in 5 minutes the dog was back to returning to the whistle as soon as the lamp was put out.

I used the shock twice the kit cost me over £250 but it was money well spent.

The dog lost it again 2 years later repeat process shocked once then 3 years before any problems.

They are an excellent device but get a bad name due to all this talk of frying a dog.

If you watch Ceaser Milan the American dog trainer training pit bulls to avoid rattle snakes with a shock collar something which is life threatening you will see the value and again used with compasiion.

Persevere mate and you will get there but I think one of the main issues is the age of your dog. 

He has abit of everything in him bull grey deerhound whippet bedlingtom and collie bit the collie is so little it wouldn't make him do that like you say I belive it's just the age when I had him out amongst the the sheep he wasn't interested in chasing nothing then still verry young then the farmer had took the sheep in for mating with in that time I've got him doing some work just ferreting and genrule hunting if a back bird moves in a bush his behind it now his put them back out in the field for lambing his changed like he thinks everything that moves he has to chase I've never had this problem with previous dogs I'm no novice but all the other dogs have seen them daily like they do the horses ect and never even looked at them but this one his a little f**ker 

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Lesson 1 with the horse whip this morning and a long ish lead 1st sheep he whent to run I smacked him then kept walking to wards the flock 2nd sheep he pulled to go a little bit smacked him then he looked at one run and stuck his ears up so smacked him after that he didn't wanna walk near the flock so I praised him up and carried on calling him toward me and stroaking hum loads for the rest of the walk so he didn't get scared of me no saying it's cured but will continue to walk him round the sheep alot more and hopfully the stick don't have to come back out 

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27 minutes ago, the lamping ferreter said:

Lesson 1 with the horse whip this morning and a long ish lead 1st sheep he whent to run I smacked him then kept walking to wards the flock 2nd sheep he pulled to go a little bit smacked him then he looked at one run and stuck his ears up so smacked him after that he didn't wanna walk near the flock so I praised him up and carried on calling him toward me and stroaking hum loads for the rest of the walk so he didn't get scared of me no saying it's cured but will continue to walk him round the sheep alot more and hopfully the stick don't have to come back out 

Sounds like you are heading in the right direction,  good luck with him

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Aye good luck not easy at time. Vary the sheep and circumstances too. You can walk them round the same shep daily for 5 months and be bang on. Then go some where else on a frosty morning ferreting and walk over the brow of hill and see half dozen running up the valley bottom and its a different ball game again :( Then you get the sly ones that know what a long line is all about. 

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Happened to me with hill sheep.. At about 12months old. Has quarter collie in him.. Knocked few sheep over looked like it could of gone alot worse if I'd not got there in time. I come down on him like 10 ton of bricks never mind ton lol.. 

After that I had him oround lots of sheep and been fine since. 

Have lamped with cattle n sheep in field and never gone after them after missing. 

But things do change in there mind when quarry is changed. Just have to keep eye on things. 

I think a shock collar is best approach rather than beating the dog, you don't want the dog to doubt a bond and resent u for it. With a collar it won't know its you. 

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23 hours ago, budgie123 said:

I had an issue with a lamping dog which just lost recall suddenly when missing a rabbit and hunted up. I tried everything to remedy this with no success.

In the context of getting a recall from a dog that hunts on when lamping, would the shock collar be used the moment the dog ignores the lamp going out and whistle / call? Mine doesn't even slow down if she thinks she is going to miss and shoots off into the night. I can get a recall when running at up to about 50 yards, but further out no chance. Recall at a distance is ok if she's just mooching around rather than running.

Did the shock collar law actually make it onto the books in England? So far as I can find, the government stated it had decided it was going to ban remote control e collars, but not those invisible fence things (makes no sense, but the law was lobbied for by Kennel Club, RSPCA and UFAW, so probably political rather than welfare aims at its core), but can't find the actual law.

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