Coterminous Renewal

[maktayla 50]

 

Thank you so much Walshie, much appreciated indeed. Think I'll try the Sports Man Gun Centre on Saturday.

Same here mate. I would have held on to them for you, but alas I don't have those calibres either. Sods law eh?

 

That sounds like quite a poor show from the South Wales Force. I have only ever had dealings with the Gwent Firearms Licensing, and I have to admit they have been spot on every time.

 

Keep your chin up mate.

Thankyou Tremo

[The one 8,391]

 

It's the same here before u surrender your old licence it makes sense to buy the most bullets you can hold as the renewal process takes that long

 

That's the point though. If you get issued a section 7 instead, you're holding all that ammo illegally.

It was my fao that said if your needing bullets buy them before you put in for a renewal maybe because you need them there prepared to turn a blind eye Ie a gun without bullets is just a bat no use to anybody

[ukhunter 105]

 

i sent my renewal forms back to TVP back in nov 2015 and still waiting for certificates

im on my 2nd lot of temporary permits which runs out in 8 days time.

I feel for you mate. That is totally disgusting. Over a year is beyond a joke. Is that for your firearms as well. If so what calibres and have you been able to go out at all

 

 

 

 

yes firearms as well bud and for ammo im on my last 100 for my 22 but i got none for my 17hmr

[maktayla 50]

 

 

i sent my renewal forms back to TVP back in nov 2015 and still waiting for certificates

im on my 2nd lot of temporary permits which runs out in 8 days time.

I feel for you mate. That is totally disgusting. Over a year is beyond a joke. Is that for your firearms as well. If so what calibres and have you been able to go out at all

 

 

 

 

yes firearms as well bud and for ammo im on my last 100 for my 22 but i got none for my 17hmr

 

​My predicament feels like nothing now, especially compared to yours. I wonder when you do eventually get your licence will it then be back dated to the time your last certificate expired?? I think that would be wrong if it is, after all, you've paid a fee and I'm sure that should also allow you to have a certificate that lasts for 5 years. Out of curiosity, are you with BASC? If so, have you been in touch and what have they said?

[The Seeker 3,048]

Perhaps they turn a blind eye to the ammunition thing seeing as the law is due to change and let's face it it is THIER problem that has put you in this mess. I'm quite sure any prosecution would be difficult given the amount of attention you have given to this in terms of contacting the FEO etc and the promptness of your renewal.

 

I must say credit where credit is sure South Yorkshire Police were very quick in renewing my certificate/s

[maktayla 50]

Perhaps they turn a blind eye to the ammunition thing seeing as the law is due to change and let's face it it is THIER problem that has put you in this mess. I'm quite sure any prosecution would be difficult given the amount of attention you have given to this in terms of contacting the FEO etc and the promptness of your renewal.

 

I must say credit where credit is sure South Yorkshire Police were very quick in renewing my certificate/s

Thanks Seeker.

Thats the main reason I tried contacting the office yesterday and my FEO. I must have made around 12 calls all in all. I agree with you if they did decide to prosecute but I really wouldnt fancy a lengthy legal battle, no rifles and so on, and then if I was cleared, how long before or, would i get my licence back??

I suppose a good solicitor would argue the law is the law (as BASC stated to me), ignorance is no excuse and its down to the individual to ensure he/she complies within the law.

Maybe if my FEO had answered or returned my calls yesterday or, the Firearms dept answered they may have said its ok to keep my ammo because they are at fault???But then, would they also be breaking the law by advising me to do this? So many what if's......I think the best thing to do is to ensure im not in possession of any expanding ammunition whatsoever when he visits me this Monday. If he asks where my ammunition is, that's when ill start asking lots of questions. If he doesnt, ill raise the issue. He shouldn't do this but, if he informs me I could have held on to my ammo because the fault lies with the Police, I will contact BASC and see what they say. I think I already know the answer to that Whatever happens, i will update this post with what he said.

I would love to give South Wales Police credit, but i'm finding it very difficult. Variations they were pretty good with. My first grant coterminous took 6 months and they certainly aint impressing me with their renewal service. And contacting them is getting beyond a joke. I understand they are busy, but ive tried for 2 days and keep getting the same message before getting cut off. It wouldnt be so bad if the call stated you are in a queue or something along those lines.Youre a lucky man with South Yorkshire Police.

 

oh yes...I do like the quotes by Churchill and Bader

 

On another note mate.....

[maktayla 50]

Now I'm really confused. Just found this on http://www.nationalgamekeepers.org.uk/media/uploads/cat-249/KtBautumn12-p40Certificates.pdf by George Wallace. So, do I now keep my ammo and wait for my FEO on Monday to see if my temp permit covers expanding ammo??? Should I have asked for this when I initially rang about a temp permit???

 

The section I found reads:

 

3. “The permit won’t allow you to keep expanding ammunition because that is Section 5.”

NONSENSE. Expanding ammo and “missiles” (bullets, to you and me) are only Section 5 (ie. prohibited) if you don’t have a certificate allowing you to possess them. The police can put that authority on a temporary permit just as easily as on a full certificate.

[walshie 2,804]

IMO he's talking out of his armpit and i wouldn't want to be the one to test his opinion. Section 5 is section 5 regardless of what's on your ticket.

[maktayla 50]

I think I have to agree with you Walshie.

Well, my FEO is here tomorrow so will be asking questions.

Maybe what I should have asked as well, from the beginning; has anyone on here been in the same predicament. Have they applied, had a temp permit and what has the FEO said when he/she came around. Did they have any expanding ammo and wasn't aware of that part of the law?? I doubt I'm the only one who has had a visit after my certificate has expired.

I'll update this after he has been to visit me tomorrow.

 

Thanks for all the replies and advice.

[Rabid 1,936]

IMO he's talking out of his armpit and i wouldn't want to be the one to test his opinion. Section 5 is section 5 regardless of what's on your ticket.

Well he isn't really talking out of his armpit is he, 'if you don't have a certificate to posses them' my point is, under a temporary permit, you do NOT have a licence to posses them, so they are section 5 and you have no lawful authority to posses them.

 

I hate to say this, but FEO, and FLO and not above telling porkies (I have personal experience of that one) remember they are enforcing the laws not making them, so even if they say, oh it's ok to keep them as we messed up, it's still not legal and they have no right to tell you that.

 

My advice, cover your Arse and put them into a RFD, then forward the bill to the licensing department, my bet is your licence will arrive quick smart once the bill hits the desk.

[walshie 2,804]

 

IMO he's talking out of his armpit and i wouldn't want to be the one to test his opinion. Section 5 is section 5 regardless of what's on your ticket.

Well he isn't really talking out of his armpit is he, 'if you don't have a certificate to posses them' my point is, under a temporary permit, you do NOT have a licence to posses them, so they are section 5 and you have no lawful authority to posses them.

 

I hate to say this, but FEO, and FLO and not above telling porkies (I have personal experience of that one) remember they are enforcing the laws not making them, so even if they say, oh it's ok to keep them as we messed up, it's still not legal and they have no right to tell you that.

 

My advice, cover your Arse and put them into a RFD, then forward the bill to the licensing department, my bet is your licence will arrive quick smart once the bill hits the desk.

 

 

He is talking shit. He clearly says the police can put authority to possess expanding ammo on a section 7 permit "just as easily as on a full certificate."

 

They can't.

[Rabid 1,936]

 

 

IMO he's talking out of his armpit and i wouldn't want to be the one to test his opinion. Section 5 is section 5 regardless of what's on your ticket.

 

Well he isn't really talking out of his armpit is he, 'if you don't have a certificate to posses them' my point is, under a temporary permit, you do NOT have a licence to posses them, so they are section 5 and you have no lawful authority to posses them.

I hate to say this, but FEO, and FLO and not above telling porkies (I have personal experience of that one) remember they are enforcing the laws not making them, so even if they say, oh it's ok to keep them as we messed up, it's still not legal and they have no right to tell you that.

My advice, cover your Arse and put them into a RFD, then forward the bill to the licensing department, my bet is your licence will arrive quick smart once the bill hits the desk.

He is talking shit. He clearly says the police can put authority to possess expanding ammo on a section 7 permit "just as easily as on a full certificate."

 

They can't.

Agreed, I would take no notice of him, clearly not going to be backed by law and could land you in hot water

[Rabid 1,936]

 

 

 

IMO he's talking out of his armpit and i wouldn't want to be the one to test his opinion. Section 5 is section 5 regardless of what's on your ticket.

Well he isn't really talking out of his armpit is he, 'if you don't have a certificate to posses them' my point is, under a temporary permit, you do NOT have a licence to posses them, so they are section 5 and you have no lawful authority to posses them.

I hate to say this, but FEO, and FLO and not above telling porkies (I have personal experience of that one) remember they are enforcing the laws not making them, so even if they say, oh it's ok to keep them as we messed up, it's still not legal and they have no right to tell you that.

My advice, cover your Arse and put them into a RFD, then forward the bill to the licensing department, my bet is your licence will arrive quick smart once the bill hits the desk.

He is talking shit. He clearly says the police can put authority to possess expanding ammo on a section 7 permit "just as easily as on a full certificate."

 

They can't.

Agreed, I would take no notice of him, clearly not going to be backed by law and could land you in hot watert

He is right on the first point about not been allowed to posses them.

[walshie 2,804]

 

 

 

 

IMO he's talking out of his armpit and i wouldn't want to be the one to test his opinion. Section 5 is section 5 regardless of what's on your ticket.

Well he isn't really talking out of his armpit is he, 'if you don't have a certificate to posses them' my point is, under a temporary permit, you do NOT have a licence to posses them, so they are section 5 and you have no lawful authority to posses them.

I hate to say this, but FEO, and FLO and not above telling porkies (I have personal experience of that one) remember they are enforcing the laws not making them, so even if they say, oh it's ok to keep them as we messed up, it's still not legal and they have no right to tell you that.

My advice, cover your Arse and put them into a RFD, then forward the bill to the licensing department, my bet is your licence will arrive quick smart once the bill hits the desk.

He is talking shit. He clearly says the police can put authority to possess expanding ammo on a section 7 permit "just as easily as on a full certificate."

 

They can't.

Agreed, I would take no notice of him, clearly not going to be backed by law and could land you in hot watert

He is right on the first point about not been allowed to posses them.

 

 

Yes he is. He's just stating the obvious though and if the OP wasn't allowed to possess them in the first place, he wouldn't have the ammo to worry about.

[stillair1 16]

 

In the meantime, I have found out that I'm not allowed to possess expanding ammunition with a temporary permit. Neither the firearms department or my FEO mentioned anything about this to me. In fact, I was told I could continue to use my firearms but I would not be allowed to purchase ammo. I knew this anyway. How on earth though, can I continue to use my rifle if I'm not allowed to possess expanding ammunition?

Could someone tell me if this is a fact, or I have just misread it? I know ignorance of the law is no excuse, and it's up to me to know the law surrounding firearms but, if this is true, not only do i know feel utterly stupid and a complete novice but, I have no idea what i'm going to do with my ammo before this coming Sunday. I will check again with my FEO tomorrow but, I thought I would post this to see if anyone else may have experienced this.

 

I have a .22-250 with Federal Shok 55gr soft point and Norma 50 gr ballistic tip. I also have a .17hmr with CCI 20gr hollow point.

 

You are quite correct, you have to park your section 5 ammo with an rfd when you have been issued with a sec 7 temporary permit. My mate has just done the same and I will be looking at the same debacle next year.