1920S Film

[leethedog 3,071]

The old fella was giving his personal opinion fatman what HE liked . Edited to ask where would I find them would honestly like to read them

Edited July 26, 2016 by leethedog

[fat man 4,740]

The old fella was giving his personal opinion fatman what HE liked . Edited to ask where would I find them would honestly like to read them

Lee i can honestly say that i have never seen what i would call even a decent Glen and i have seen a few over the years but wheatens or staffs are a different kettle of fish,seen some really good working dogs from both breeds but then again that was also a good many years ago.I think there was a thread up here a couple of year ago about the trials in which someone put up a report from some of them stating certified dogs.

[jiggy 3,207]

Most bulls would push forward while wheatens would pull back which would make the wheatens excell when timed which is why the good wheatens have reduced in number with the demise of the trials.

[Kaizer Sozĕ 266]

An early photograph of a KBT litter

 

Early Kerry Blue Litter in the 20's.jpg

 

Also Kerry Blues were still trailed up to the 60's

 

KBT Trialled 1960.jpg

 

Later the Staff / Irish Staff were the most prominent at the trials.

Working Wheatens were there as well but they were thought of as better in the field.

 

I was talking to men at the Westmeath WTC show who remembered them and their work.

To hear these men describe how the Wheaten excelled at manoeuvring corners while working

reminded me how the guys who bred these dogs had such a high standard.

 

But without a small Jack Russell to spend time sounding and allowing the dig to take place,

The strong dogs would have seen little work.

Some of these strong dogs heads would not fit into a burrow.

 

Nice pics p3d that pic of an early litter of KBs could easily be mistaken for a pic of patterdales/fells/lakelands!!

[fat man 4,740]

Most bulls would push forward while wheatens would pull back which would make the wheatens excell when timed which is why the good wheatens have reduced in number with the demise of the trials.

It made no difference whether they pushed or tried to draw,there was a time limit they had to achieve in silence and that was the way they were judged,they had to reach there game also within a time limit and then work it.I reckon there is still plenty of good wheatens about just that the men that keep them keep a tight ship.

[neil cooney 10,415]

 

I think the video is showing Kerry Blues , not Wheatens,,,,

lolol that blows Neil's opinion that Kerry's don't do anything lololololol

 

They didn't then and they don't do anything now.

If you run a trial for Kerry Blues then you will find out which is gamest. That's how it was done by the K.C. 'till '66. After that the trials fell into the hands of terriermen and they were open to all breeds. That's when the Kerry Blue and the Glen were shown to be the curs that they truly were.

Like I've always said, the Kerry Blue and the Glen were rough curs. So were / are most Staffs and Wheatens but those two breeds can throw up some game ones too. Let's face it, the test was 6 minutes. Is that a great test ?

A friend of mine ran many trials and always made sure there was over half an hour before a dog would run a chute again so the dog had time to quieten down and feel the affects of his last trial before going again. This tested them in his opinion. Also, the terriers he used to acquire the badgers for his trials were all hard lakeland/borders that he couldn't have used in a trail as they were too hard. But the sounders on the day probably wouldn't have been good enough to provide badgers for the day itself, LOL. This was all back before badger digging became illegal.

Also, someone mentioned that Wheatens were know for drawing and staffs would often lie with it. Most lads would disagree. The Wheaten would lie there with it but the Staff would like a tug.

Regarding Glens as workers ? It's a pity they're so scarce and whoever said they were great strongdogs was talking rubbish. Some people can only compare dogs to what they've seen. If they've only seen bad un's then that's what they have to compare them too.

A friend of mine has a large kennel of Glens and will only breed of ones that he see's some fire in. I brought him out around 15 years ago and we showed some of his Glens a bit of hunting. He asked my opinion and I gave him an honest one.

He took on what I said and he put a Pit Bull of mine, Blitz, across one of his Glen bitches. The litter came out looking just like Glens but a little shorter in the coat, but f**k me, they were beauties. He registered them as pure Glens and I hope they've been used to saturate Glen lines.

I have some nice photos of them but couldn't put them up as they'd get him in trouble, LOL.

[fat man 4,740]

 

 

I think the video is showing Kerry Blues , not Wheatens,,,,

lolol that blows Neil's opinion that Kerry's don't do anything lololololol

 

They didn't then and they don't do anything now.

If you run a trial for Kerry Blues then you will find out which is gamest. That's how it was done by the K.C. 'till '66. After that the trials fell into the hands of terriermen and they were open to all breeds. That's when the Kerry Blue and the Glen were shown to be the curs that they truly were.

Like I've always said, the Kerry Blue and the Glen were rough curs. So were / are most Staffs and Wheatens but those two breeds can throw up some game ones too. Let's face it, the test was 6 minutes. Is that a great test ?

A friend of mine ran many trials and always made sure there was over half an hour before a dog would run a chute again so the dog had time to quieten down and feel the affects of his last trial before going again. This tested them in his opinion. Also, the terriers he used to acquire the badgers for his trials were all hard lakeland/borders that he couldn't have used in a trail as they were too hard. But the sounders on the day probably wouldn't have been good enough to provide badgers for the day itself, LOL. This was all back before badger digging became illegal.

Also, someone mentioned that Wheatens were know for drawing and staffs would often lie with it. Most lads would disagree. The Wheaten would lie there with it but the Staff would like a tug.

Regarding Glens as workers ? It's a pity they're so scarce and whoever said they were great strongdogs was talking rubbish. Some people can only compare dogs to what they've seen. If they've only seen bad un's then that's what they have to compare them too.

A friend of mine has a large kennel of Glens and will only breed of ones that he see's some fire in. I brought him out around 15 years ago and we showed some of his Glens a bit of hunting. He asked my opinion and I gave him an honest one.

He took on what I said and he put a Pit Bull of mine, Blitz, across one of his Glen bitches. The litter came out looking just like Glens but a little shorter in the coat, but f**k me, they were beauties. He registered them as pure Glens and I hope they've been used to saturate Glen lines.

I have some nice photos of them but couldn't put them up as they'd get him in trouble, LOL.

 

I seen both Staffs and wheatens work and they were owned by a very well known digging club from NI and they were top notch,bred and built for the job in hand not anything like the size of strong dogs that are bred today,the shoots were purpose built and bigger dogs would struggle to travel in them.There is actually a wheaten dog across the road from me that a young lad bought of a well known dog man from the south that had told the lad the dog had qualified at trials[lies] why people do it is beyond me.

[jiggy 3,207]

It fcuking amazes me how some people can dictate what does and doesnt work in other peoples yards that they have never been in before and are experts on what did and didnt happen before they were even born fcuk me some of the lads on here must be 150 years old to be experts in these fields or else they read it in books which are always 100% truth.......yeah right......

[THE GENERAL 1,975]

It fcuking amazes me how some people can dictate what does and doesnt work in other peoples yards that they have never been in before and are experts on what did and didnt happen before they were even born fcuk me some of the lads on here must be 150 years old to be experts in these fields or else they read it in books which are always 100% truth.......yeah right......

I don't think anyone's dictating, more giving there opinion on what has been the overall better breds of trial dogs, compared to the others over the years. Any certs i have that date back to the early 60s onwards are all of wheaten terriers. Any others I've ever seen are wheatens or staffs. None of the old timers that I did or would know, that where there and bought the t-shirt so to speak, haven't much to say about Kerry's or Glens. That's not to say there was no gooduns. Is it just a coincidence that staffs and wheatens seemed to be better suited for the job, or did I just not know the right men? I know one thing, I could rhyme of names of wheatens and staffs that excelled at the trials but i would have bother doing the same with any Kerry blues or Glens.

[jiggy 3,207]

You can have an idea what breeds were like in the 60,s but in the early 1900,s its only guess work its getting back far enough that wheatens, glens, and kerry blues were nearly all the same thing and far different from the show stuff we have now.

[fat man 4,740]

You can have an idea what breeds were like in the 60,s but in the early 1900,s its only guess work its getting back far enough that wheatens, glens, and kerry blues were nearly all the same thing and far different from the show stuff we have now.

The wheatens from the 60s,70s 80s are far removed from the wheatens that are paraded about nowadays.I have not seen any reports of trials from the 1900,s or of how Glens or Kerry blue,s fared out in the field but on written evedence and from what i seen myself the wheaten excelled in the field as did the staff and hasve seen a few crosses of these type that also done the job but i can honestly say i have never seen a decent glen or Kerry blue in the field.Lads about half hour away from me kept Glens for years and i seen these in action on a number of occasions and they were not what i would call usefull,too big to reach fox and not game enough to stay till dug with other game, jmo Jiggy on what i have seen,there may be good Glens or even Kerry,s about but i have yet to see1.We once had a GHXPOINTER bitch that when in heat she got out of her run and went down into a yard where a lad had a Kerry as a guard dog.He covered the bitch and she had 4 pups,all of which were complete headers from an early age,wanted to bite everyone they seen and in the field were useless.

[chesney 5,326]

My opinion on these dogs is they all has their day they had useful purpose at one time but not anymore it's the terriers that do the work now whether they be black ones or white ones. I could never see the attraction for a big lump around a dig (except for me leaning on the shovel lol) it just my opinion but I suppose everyone to their own.

[THE GENERAL 1,975]

My opinion on these dogs is they all has their day they had useful purpose at one time but not anymore it's the terriers that do the work now whether they be black ones or white ones. I could never see the attraction for a big lump around a dig (except for me leaning on the shovel lol) it just my opinion but I suppose everyone to their own.

I agree Chesney but lucky enough there is still men that keep the line alive, which should be done so that they don't be lost to the KC crap you see today. Terriers done the work back in the day also but as Neil said the majority of terriers that provided the game for the trials never got a certificate as they wouldn't work as required in a shore, mainly because they were too hard and had to be lifted. Quite ironic Imo. Fox dogs won more certificates something I never agreed with. The terriers should have been judged properly in a bank on a dig but there's no point in crying over spilt milk because it fell on deaf ears anyway.

[pablo esc 1,598]

What did you think of the Glenn crosses Fatman , in a mix of terrier's, I met a few lads going on about digging with them.same lads though would say alot of all the lark.whever some good or how work i dont know

[chesney 5,326]

 

My opinion on these dogs is they all has their day they had useful purpose at one time but not anymore it's the terriers that do the work now whether they be black ones or white ones. I could never see the attraction for a big lump around a dig (except for me leaning on the shovel lol) it just my opinion but I suppose everyone to their own.

I agree Chesney but lucky enough there is still men that keep the line alive, which should be done so that they don't be lost to the KC crap you see today. Terriers done the work back in the day also but as Neil said the majority of terriers that provided the game for the trials never got a certificate as they wouldn't work as required in a shore, mainly because they were too hard and had to be lifted. Quite ironic Imo. Fox dogs won more certificates something I never agreed with. The terriers should have been judged properly in a bank on a dig but there's no point in crying over spilt milk because it fell on deaf ears anyway.

I see where your coming from general and goodluck to the men trying to preserve those working lines of wheatens trying to keep it separate from the kc lines must be a battle alone. Theres mass production of blackdogs about at the moment and most of it for coin only hope it doesn't lead to the ruination of some very strong lines.