potshot86 0 Posted June 5, 2012 Report Share Posted June 5, 2012 Me and a pal bought 100 gamebore mammoth 3 1/2" 42g no 3's as they were going cheap. Would they be too much for duck on the marsh as I don't want to use them for geese on the foreshore? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ferretmad 2 Posted June 6, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2012 Me and a pal bought 100 gamebore mammoth 3 1/2" 42g no 3's as they were going cheap. Would they be too much for duck on the marsh as I don't want to use them for geese on the foreshore? i think you would a mate of mine uses 62g homeloads for ducks as well as geese Quote Link to post Share on other sites
remi700 99 Posted June 7, 2012 Report Share Posted June 7, 2012 62 grams that has to be lead. 62 grams of steel shot wouldn't fit even in a 3 1/2" casing. The bottom line is steel is shite! Completely useless for all things except firing at a pattern plate. The main reason I say this is it has no spread until its too late. You will do one of three things to a duck with steel shot. 1. If a duck is within 25 yards and you are fortunate enough to connect with the narrow window of shot that steel gives you will blow the duck to pieces!!! 2. The more likely scenario, you will clean miss the duck because of lack of spread. 3. A duck comes over at thirty yards, you catch it full ball but the duck goes on because the shot has lost too much energy to kill effectively. It doesn't matter how big a load you go for or what pellet size you use, steel is steel and it still faces the same problems. You will hear time and time again people ranting on about how many grains they can get in a 30 inch circle with steel but in all honesty this is practically useless when it comes to the real world. Tom Rooster an well regarded ballistic scientist conducted a study of shot ducks. His results showed that 3 out of 4 ducks shot with lead were shot with 'flyer pellets' (ie deformed pellets flying outside the typical pattern). Because of the perfect forming of steel shot this is something you just wont have. I've seen articles in american water-fowler where they talk about shooting geese at sixty yards with steel. I wonder if the person who wrote those articles ever set something goose sized on the ground and stepped back 60 yards to see how far away it looks! To toss anything outside of thirty yards with it would certainly take a lucky grain in the head. I'm from N.Ireland so i'm lucky enough to still be able to shoot lead over lands not considered to be wetlands, most of my shooting is made up of grass field goose shooting and mallard but later in the season we turn to divers on the lough and have no choice but use steel shot. I'd say the number of woundey's I've had in the past 3 seasons has went up 10 fold! For some reason it just wont kill woundeys on the water either. I've fired at wounded golden eye and tufted on the top of the water with it from 15 yards away again and again and it seems to have no effect. I'f I were you heading to the marsh and not shooting an awful lot of shells id be trying to go the bismuth or hevi shot route. It's going to be expensive though so take a deep breath before entering the gun shop! Atb Mark Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ferretmad 2 Posted June 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 62 grams that has to be lead. 62 grams of steel shot wouldn't fit even in a 3 1/2" casing. The bottom line is steel is shite! Completely useless for all things except firing at a pattern plate. The main reason I say this is it has no spread until its too late. You will do one of three things to a duck with steel shot. 1. If a duck is within 25 yards and you are fortunate enough to connect with the narrow window of shot that steel gives you will blow the duck to pieces!!! 2. The more likely scenario, you will clean miss the duck because of lack of spread. 3. A duck comes over at thirty yards, you catch it full ball but the duck goes on because the shot has lost too much energy to kill effectively. It doesn't matter how big a load you go for or what pellet size you use, steel is steel and it still faces the same problems. You will hear time and time again people ranting on about how many grains they can get in a 30 inch circle with steel but in all honesty this is practically useless when it comes to the real world. Tom Rooster an well regarded ballistic scientist conducted a study of shot ducks. His results showed that 3 out of 4 ducks shot with lead were shot with 'flyer pellets' (ie deformed pellets flying outside the typical pattern). Because of the perfect forming of steel shot this is something you just wont have. I've seen articles in american water-fowler where they talk about shooting geese at sixty yards with steel. I wonder if the person who wrote those articles ever set something goose sized on the ground and stepped back 60 yards to see how far away it looks! To toss anything outside of thirty yards with it would certainly take a lucky grain in the head. I'm from N.Ireland so i'm lucky enough to still be able to shoot lead over lands not considered to be wetlands, most of my shooting is made up of grass field goose shooting and mallard but later in the season we turn to divers on the lough and have no choice but use steel shot. I'd say the number of woundey's I've had in the past 3 seasons has went up 10 fold! For some reason it just wont kill woundeys on the water either. I've fired at wounded golden eye and tufted on the top of the water with it from 15 yards away again and again and it seems to have no effect. I'f I were you heading to the marsh and not shooting an awful lot of shells id be trying to go the bismuth or hevi shot route. It's going to be expensive though so take a deep breath before entering the gun shop! Atb Mark a good post that the thing is here in england there trying to ban lead for game aswell now! im sure my mate said 62g ill ask him next time i see him. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wag 13 Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 Me and a pal bought 100 gamebore mammoth 3 1/2" 42g no 3's as they were going cheap. Would they be too much for duck on the marsh as I don't want to use them for geese on the foreshore? Nothing wrong with steel if you know what it's capabilities are , your always going to get some people say that steel is crap and you can't get a clean kill from it, "Well" you will Not! shooting at fowl out of range... some but not all fowlers have trouble judging distance and that's where the fault lies . .... I shoot steel all year round at clays , pigeons , wildfowl, a lot of people make the mistake of just going out and buying steel cartridges ,and using them without testing them through there guns and patterning them to find the right cartridge that suits there gun some people may think what a load of rubbish but believe me it's true ... Also your choice of chokes make a big difference , i have just changed my gun from beretta ,to winchester and have had to do more patterning to find a steel cartridge load to suit my gun , i have also gone onto patternmaster chokes with great!! results , i now have a load for ducks up to 40 yards with a good clean kill, and that is the most important thing a "clean kill" ..... you hear of lads saying i fetched a duck out at 50yards perhaps so but was it a clean kill, not a broken wing ....for me it's all about a clean kill .... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wino 3 Posted June 22, 2012 Report Share Posted June 22, 2012 (edited) I've got an AYA no.3 3" magnum choked to around 1/4 so I reckon I'm safe using steel shot up to about 36gms. Anyone else use an AYA mag on the marsh and if so what do you put through it? Obviously I know that HP steel is a no-no. Edited June 22, 2012 by Wino Quote Link to post Share on other sites
charlie brown 0 Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 I've got an AYA no.3 3" magnum choked to around 1/4 so I reckon I'm safe using steel shot up to about 36gms. Anyone else use an AYA mag on the marsh and if so what do you put through it? Obviously I know that HP steel is a no-no. sounds about right for a AYA magnum around 36 gms of steel, i had mine bored to half and half and its fine, the best round ive put through it for foreshore ducks is Hevi Shot Game loads, shame they are expensive but they work really well. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wino 3 Posted June 26, 2012 Report Share Posted June 26, 2012 sounds about right for a AYA magnum around 36 gms of steel, i had mine bored to half and half and its fine, the best round ive put through it for foreshore ducks is Hevi Shot Game loads, shame they are expensive but they work really well. What sort of money are you paying for 25? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
fellamilad 0 Posted June 26, 2012 Report Share Posted June 26, 2012 Me and a pal bought 100 gamebore mammoth 3 1/2" 42g no 3's as they were going cheap. Would they be too much for duck on the marsh as I don't want to use them for geese on the foreshore? Nothing wrong with steel if you know what it's capabilities are , your always going to get some people say that steel is crap and you can't get a clean kill from it, "Well" you will Not! shooting at fowl out of range... some but not all fowlers have trouble judging distance and that's where the fault lies . .... I shoot steel all year round at clays , pigeons , wildfowl, a lot of people make the mistake of just going out and buying steel cartridges ,and using them without testing them through there guns and patterning them to find the right cartridge that suits there gun some people may think what a load of rubbish but believe me it's true ... Also your choice of chokes make a big difference , i have just changed my gun from beretta ,to winchester and have had to do more patterning to find a steel cartridge load to suit my gun , i have also gone onto patternmaster chokes with great!! results , i now have a load for ducks up to 40 yards with a good clean kill, and that is the most important thing a "clean kill" ..... you hear of lads saying i fetched a duck out at 50yards perhaps so but was it a clean kill, not a broken wing ....for me it's all about a clean kill .... at last someone else who loves steel, i second every word. homeload is the way forward expensive to get going but reliability and choice at your finger tips Quote Link to post Share on other sites
remi700 99 Posted June 26, 2012 Report Share Posted June 26, 2012 Not if you live in Ireland and cant get any components!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toby63 1,236 Posted July 18, 2012 Report Share Posted July 18, 2012 i use on geese is bornaghi mini mags 70mm 36g 4s .good pattern on them.last yr i ad 2 for 1 shot.mate was wel niffed off.we ad a good morning ad 14 between us.we was at sum quarry site that i ave permission .mostly canadas. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
windmig 1 Posted August 30, 2012 Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 Hi, I don't see any of you using tungsten cartridge? They are very expensive (in France) but they are also very good. Supposed to be better than lead. Do you have them in the UK ? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MOO 730 Posted August 30, 2012 Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 for geese on the foreshore hevi loads are the best ive tried infact they are very very good catridge I use bufallo 36g4s as an allround load for vermin and duck and geese a good killing catridge that is not too excpencive ...I have to disagree with you wag regarding steel shot I have fired 100s of steel shot catridges trying various chokes and it just didnt cut it infact the last lot of mammoth steel shot I had I chucked as I found it just didnt have the stopping power and was down right cruel pricking to many birds .....the whole lead shot aruement is nonsence they did study up here where the sived the mud on a heavily shot area and found no lead shot whats so ever ..... what is happening up here is the wardens are radomly checking birds for lead shot ...so if someone sees a pricked bird on the mud they will not pick it incase it has been shot with lead ....the law regarding lead shot is wrong imo to many birds are suffering Quote Link to post Share on other sites
windmig 1 Posted August 30, 2012 Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 In France, hevi loads are forbidden but I really don't know why... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
trentotter 158 Posted August 30, 2012 Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 personally ive never had a problem with hull's solway steels,36g 4mm.but then most of the geese i shoot are only20-30 yards away.. ive used winchester super X 3 1/2in steels and they work well to 45-50 yard ,but id rather pay £7 a box for the solway's than £25 a box for he winnie's.... i am from yorkshire!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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