Patterdale Terrier blog???

[grafter-man 43]

busterdog, I indeed could see that if the terriers continued to be kenneled together or right next to each other, but, I'm speaking about not kenneling the dogs together or even within eye distance for that matter. It would hard for any intimidation what so ever if the terriers cant even see each other wouldn't it?? If my terriers cant get along and choose to fight or intimidate I seperate them ALL TOGETHER. It would depend on how much yard a fellow has, or, AGAIN, room or space to properly house and care for it properly. ALL THE BEST

[grafter-man 43]

OK THE ONE THING YOU LADS ARE OVERLOOKING IS MY STATEMENT "ROOM OR SPACE TO PROPERLY CARE FOR THE TERRIERS". THAT MEANS IF BULLYING OR INTIMIDATION IS GOING ON THEN PUT THEM IN A KENNEL TOTALLY AWAY FROM ONE ANOTHER, COMPLETELY OUT OF SIGHT IF NEED BE. I AGREE BULLYING OR INTIMIDATION CAN HAVE ITS SET-BACKS, BUT SO CAN NO COMMON SENSE TO KENNEL THEM NEXT TO EACH OTHER IF THEY HAVE TO BE SEPERATED, AND BUSTERDOG IT IS ONE THING TO GIVE THE PUPS AWAY, BUT I AM SPEAKING ABOUT BREEDING A BITCH EVERY CYCLE ONLTY TO HOLD BACK A SINGLE PUP AND SELLING THE MAJORITY OF EVERY LITTER.

[stevie g 2005 125]

OK THE ONE THING YOU LADS ARE OVERLOOKING IS MY STATEMENT "ROOM OR SPACE TO PROPERLY CARE FOR THE TERRIERS". THAT MEANS IF BULLYING OR INTIMIDATION IS GOING ON THEN PUT THEM IN A KENNEL TOTALLY AWAY FROM ONE ANOTHER, COMPLETELY OUT OF SIGHT IF NEED BE. I AGREE BULLYING OR INTIMIDATION CAN HAVE ITS SET-BACKS, BUT SO CAN NO COMMON SENSE TO KENNEL THEM NEXT TO EACH OTHER IF THEY HAVE TO BE SEPERATED, AND BUSTERDOG IT IS ONE THING TO GIVE THE PUPS AWAY, BUT I AM SPEAKING ABOUT BREEDING A BITCH EVERY CYCLE ONLTY TO HOLD BACK A SINGLE PUP AND SELLING THE MAJORITY OF EVERY LITTER.

 

u must have had a bad experince with peddlers [ who hasnt] i think it part of the game were in now and i pity any young lad that is starting out that has no decent contacts cos if he is serious about the game it will cost him a few pound before he finds the secert is meeting self minded folk that only have the best intrest in the working terrier. there are a lot of lads out there that live in housing estates that have done more for keeping the terrier scence full of decent working stock and alot of them only bread for one reason that is to keep there own yard stocked but most of these fella wont dream of selling and pups are passed among mates all this has been said before there are good honest folf still out there

[grafter-man 43]

OK THE ONE THING YOU LADS ARE OVERLOOKING IS MY STATEMENT "ROOM OR SPACE TO PROPERLY CARE FOR THE TERRIERS". THAT MEANS IF BULLYING OR INTIMIDATION IS GOING ON THEN PUT THEM IN A KENNEL TOTALLY AWAY FROM ONE ANOTHER, COMPLETELY OUT OF SIGHT IF NEED BE. I AGREE BULLYING OR INTIMIDATION CAN HAVE ITS SET-BACKS, BUT SO CAN NO COMMON SENSE TO KENNEL THEM NEXT TO EACH OTHER IF THEY HAVE TO BE SEPERATED, AND BUSTERDOG IT IS ONE THING TO GIVE THE PUPS AWAY, BUT I AM SPEAKING ABOUT BREEDING A BITCH EVERY CYCLE ONLTY TO HOLD BACK A SINGLE PUP AND SELLING THE MAJORITY OF EVERY LITTER.

 

u must have had a bad experince with peddlers [ who hasnt] i think it part of the game were in now and i pity any young lad that is starting out that has no decent contacts cos if he is serious about the game it will cost him a few pound before he finds the secert is meeting self minded folk that only have the best intrest in the working terrier. there are a lot of lads out there that live in housing estates that have done more for keeping the terrier scence full of decent working stock and alot of them only bread for one reason that is to keep there own yard stocked but most of these fella wont dream of selling and pups are passed among mates all this has been said before there are good honest folf still out there

Great post, very true. It just makes me sick to see a peddler breed a bitch every cyle, hold back bitch pup from the litter,(obviously to again to breed and peddle pups from) and then peddle the rest of the litter for money to the first person or people (whom most of the time they dont know anything about or their plans for the pup) that can come up with the money with little or no concern to if the terrier will be worked, care, etc. money, money, money,! Okay now have I made myself clear, you know the obvious way every website peddler is doing things these days? I.E. every site that breeds and sales Booth dogs!! If you dont agree, call deadgame and talk terriers or pups, no question in the terriers concern, only how much it will cost, just call!

Edited May 21, 2011 by grafter-man

[stevie g 2005 125]

OK THE ONE THING YOU LADS ARE OVERLOOKING IS MY STATEMENT "ROOM OR SPACE TO PROPERLY CARE FOR THE TERRIERS". THAT MEANS IF BULLYING OR INTIMIDATION IS GOING ON THEN PUT THEM IN A KENNEL TOTALLY AWAY FROM ONE ANOTHER, COMPLETELY OUT OF SIGHT IF NEED BE. I AGREE BULLYING OR INTIMIDATION CAN HAVE ITS SET-BACKS, BUT SO CAN NO COMMON SENSE TO KENNEL THEM NEXT TO EACH OTHER IF THEY HAVE TO BE SEPERATED, AND BUSTERDOG IT IS ONE THING TO GIVE THE PUPS AWAY, BUT I AM SPEAKING ABOUT BREEDING A BITCH EVERY CYCLE ONLTY TO HOLD BACK A SINGLE PUP AND SELLING THE MAJORITY OF EVERY LITTER.

 

u must have had a bad experince with peddlers [ who hasnt] i think it part of the game were in now and i pity any young lad that is starting out that has no decent contacts cos if he is serious about the game it will cost him a few pound before he finds the secert is meeting self minded folk that only have the best intrest in the working terrier. there are a lot of lads out there that live in housing estates that have done more for keeping the terrier scence full of decent working stock and alot of them only bread for one reason that is to keep there own yard stocked but most of these fella wont dream of selling and pups are passed among mates all this has been said before there are good honest folf still out there

Great post, very true. It just makes me sick to see a peddler breed a bitch every cyle, hold back bitch pup from the litter,(obviously to again to breed and peddle pups from) and then peddle the rest of the litter for money to the first person or people (whom most of the time they dont know anything about or their plans for the pup) that can come up with the money with little or no concern to if the terrier will be worked, care, etc. money, money, money,! Okay now have I made myself clear, you know the obvious way every website peddler is doing things these days? I.E. every site that breeds and sales Booth dogs!! If you dont agree, call deadgame and talk terriers or pups, no question in the terriers concern, only how much it will cost, just call!

been through that dead game site and i do agree with u that it does condone selling dogs at ridiculous prices but what we should be doing is highlighting this. i have also seen a thread on there about a bitch that has been bread off many a time and the fella would agree that the bitch has not been brought on properly ie seen earth work but he will maintain she is well bread so she should be bread off [MONEY TALK]no intrested in working abilty worker to worker always and if ur lucky enough to own a decent line of workers it should be bread of that bunch of dogs i have spent a few pound over the years on dogs to be honest pure shite i have 3 dogs here at the min 2 are doing well that i got for nothing thats why i sayu theres decent folk still out there

[grafter-man 43]

I agree..

[Guest busterdog]

GM i didn't want to get into anything personal and i won't but some of us mere mortals only have limited space, no matter where i put my dogs they're in the same yard. It's not all about space it's about the socialisation of them and who can afford to stay off work while you juggle dogs here there and everywhere "time is money", they all need time and care.

I've seen the site and totaly agree with you all i was saying is it's sometimes easier to part company with a dog or bitch when you aren't getting the best for one reason or another...IE give to a trusted friend.

[Mosby 355]

I recently had a litter born here. I knew I wanted pups from the breeding but also knew that I would only have space for a few. I have a small group of friends that hunt as much and sometimes more than I do. We all know that when a litter is coming from anyone of us we could very well be taking on a pup for our friend. I know from experience that a good pup becomes better with more attention and more outings. I wouldn't expect myself to raise a whole litter of nine. I wouldn't want to raise a whole litter of six. But on the other hand. I wouldn't make a breeding for just a single pup. It would take forever to get a yard of great dogs trying one pup a year. I am taking on 4 pups right now and I can say I have my hands very full but I wouldn't take on a load like that without knowing I can give adequate time to starting all of them properly. As far as deadgame is concerned. Seems an old story to me. When you think about it though how many legitimate hunters are getting ripped off or mislead by the guy? Even a newbie if hunting often will realize that it is a scam to sell any pup for a high price. It only takes someone who is serious about hunting a few dogs to realize that every pup doesn't turn out and that he'd be crazy to spend high dollars on one. I think it is wasted energy to vent and moan about the so called booth clan. Even if I had been ripped off, I would not feel the need. I started like anybody else. I payed High dollar for a couple dogs. One was good, one was not.I never felt injured by the man who sold them to me. He never made guarantees or such things. I learned quickly that great dogs come for free as well as they come from money. It's funny, I don't hear retriever breeders or pointer breeders moaning as much as we terriermen. Why does anyone else's affair matter so long as we like what is in our own yard?

[tinytiger 822]

i dont think ye need to worry about any other site out there, this site does more damage than any to the terrier world and hunting in general.. every inaccuracy and terriermans daydreams are found right here..

I would have to disagree somewhat mate. I must admit that I have strolled through the Deadgame Message board, his website, Booth's website, JJ's website, southern patterdale's site, etc. Every website or messageboard that's associated with Booth is associated with peddling. The deadgame messageboard, in my opinion, was developed for nothing more than to further the peddling of Booth's terriers. Everyone there including the mods approve of, and incourage peddling. I think the mod and the blokes that own it are the biggest shite peddlers in our sport today, imo, or at least their actions and posts lead me to believe that to be true. I have read threads and posts on that board that made me sick. Some lads purchased terriers from the mod that they were not happy with, upon them returning the shite-dog back to the mod, he in turn, peddled it off to the next lad in line instead of doing the right thing and backfilling with the terrier. Or at least that is what I read off that site.

there hasnt been any dogs for sale on that for ages, u must be taking things up wrong, yes dogs have changed hands between people on the site but doesnt that happen everywhere, if u bred a litter of pups wud u keep them all?

Well lad, First off, I wouldn't make the breeding if I didn't have the space to properly house and care for the terriers. I only keep and breed terriers for my own personal use. I would never breed with the thoughts of only holding a single pup back for myself only to peddle the siblings off, or, breed and sale the majority of every litter. Okay mate fair play, but, why do they continue to cover the bitch every heat? If you think they don't mate, then you should look a bit deeper into the happenings around ye and check the breedings and for sale sections of their websites and message boards from time to time That is still peddling in my eyes. I will give you a great example, I have read a post in which Booth stated, his Tonic was bred some 18 times. And that was just one, of the many bitches he kenneled, same as the website kennels. That is still peddling mate. Why the feck would any bloke have to cover any bitch 18 times?? I feel to get the best out of what any litter produces, I should kennel them and when they are of proper age, work them, and keep what satisfied my personal expectations and backfill with what ever didn't, but, that is just my take and how I do things. all the best. graft them hard lads

 

Have i accidentally logged into some Tour de France forum?? I disagree with you about keeping whole litters-some will always lag behind due to getting bullied by their siblings-a change of scene and they could be a different dog.

So basically, you admit that you either, dont have room or space to care for terriers properly, or too lazy, or dont have the common sense to seperate the pups to prevent this? That is what my statement meant. "room or space to care for the terriers PROPERLY". Their change of scene as you posted should mean, seperated in their own spots or kennels, not peddled off for money. I'm not having a go at you or slagging, but, come on fellow, even an idiot knows if the pups are harming their siblings, then seperate them. This is what I mean by not breeding if you cant handle the litter or have peddling on your mind. all the best

 

They dont actually have to be physically harming each other or in direct contact,eye contact +general intimidation can do it as well.My bicycle is punctured at the moment.

what a load of shite!!!! :wankerzo4:

 

THe dog mongo that i bred and was nicked off a friend of mine last year could put other dogs off their food from 50 yards away while locked in.Go and look at a few documentaries about wolves-the shiteater of one pack could go on to be the leader of another.

[wexford Pa 84]

GM i think ur just stirring shit now, to be fair, yes the americans buy dogs for obscene amounts of money but thats mainly amongst thereselves.. R Booth aint american and Deadgame message board aint his either,.. So do you think breeders are peddlers or how do you differentiate the two?

[Mosby 355]

I think the difference between a breeder and a peddler is the goal in mind. Money? or Better dogs? and are the dogs going to someone who will better the line/breed/type? Secondly, I have no problem with selling a pup for a reasonable price to someone who will work the dog. It costs alot to raise a litter. But it should be cheap enough that it doesn't put a person at a loss when the dog doesn't work out.A peddler on the other hand breeds unusable amounts of dogs for people who are handing over large sums of money. As I said above, it just doesn't matter to me what others do with their dogs. What I do care about is that there is a subculture in the terriers that will berate even good hunters for selling a dog. I think it is reasonable to get back what you put into the pups as far as shots and food and time. As far as selling adult dogs. I would put absolutely no bar on how much a good hunting terrier is worth. There have been dogs I'd have paid over a thousand for if ever they had been for sale. mind I've only seen two like that but they exist and I don't think a hunter should be put down for offering a good dog at a price. Sad thing is that people sell shit more often than good stock. There is a balance where money and working dogs is concerned. Even Frank Buck was known to have thought that any dog on his yard had a price on it. I think the squirrel hunters in america have found a really great balance. They make loads of money in competition hunting with their dogs. Sometime tens of thousands off a single dog but when breeding time comes you can nab a pup for $200 about the equivelant of 100 pounds. I've never heard hound hunters or cur or feist hunters whine about pups being sold. I think the whining creates as much a barrier to newbies as high priced dogs. The real harm is done by hunters who make constant smart ass remarks to those new to the sport and genuinely interested. I know some great, I repeat great hunters, who refuse to get on and share any knowledge because they get nothing but gibes and snide remarks back. There should be more openness and fellowship in the terrier world and alot less complaining about what others are doing.

[wexford Pa 84]

I think the difference between a breeder and a peddler is the goal in mind. Money? or Better dogs? and are the dogs going to someone who will better the line/breed/type? Secondly, I have no problem with selling a pup for a reasonable price to someone who will work the dog. It costs alot to raise a litter. But it should be cheap enough that it doesn't put a person at a loss when the dog doesn't work out.A peddler on the other hand breeds unusable amounts of dogs for people who are handing over large sums of money. As I said above, it just doesn't matter to me what others do with their dogs. What I do care about is that there is a subculture in the terriers that will berate even good hunters for selling a dog. I think it is reasonable to get back what you put into the pups as far as shots and food and time. As far as selling adult dogs. I would put absolutely no bar on how much a good hunting terrier is worth. There have been dogs I'd have paid over a thousand for if ever they had been for sale. mind I've only seen two like that but they exist and I don't think a hunter should be put down for offering a good dog at a price. Sad thing is that people sell shit more often than good stock. There is a balance where money and working dogs is concerned. Even Frank Buck was known to have thought that any dog on his yard had a price on it. I think the squirrel hunters in america have found a really great balance. They make loads of money in competition hunting with their dogs. Sometime tens of thousands off a single dog but when breeding time comes you can nab a pup for $200 about the equivelant of 100 pounds. I've never heard hound hunters or cur or feist hunters whine about pups being sold. I think the whining creates as much a barrier to newbies as high priced dogs. The real harm is done by hunters who make constant smart ass remarks to those new to the sport and genuinely interested. I know some great, I repeat great hunters, who refuse to get on and share any knowledge because they get nothing but gibes and snide remarks back. There should be more openness and fellowship in the terrier world and alot less complaining about what others are doing.

well said mosby, very good post

[John.s 4]

PA. you seem hell bent on defending Booth do you have any booth dogs?

[wexford Pa 84]

PA. you seem hell bent on defending Booth do you have any booth dogs?

no i dont, im just telling how it is..

[grafter-man 43]

GM i think ur just stirring shit now, to be fair, yes the americans buy dogs for obscene amounts of money but thats mainly amongst thereselves.. R Booth aint american and Deadgame message board aint his either,.. So do you think breeders are peddlers or how do you differentiate the two?

I feel a peddler is someone who breeds with the sole intention of profiting from the litter in mind, instead of doing what is right for the litter,terrier, his family, or line of terriers. Someone who will breed untested terriers etc with the sole intention of profit. A breeder is someone who very carefully or selectively breeds seasoned workers for the sole purpose of complimenting or bettering his line or family of terriers in mind with every breeding. Always looking to better his family of terriers. So I believe what sets a breeder and a peddler apart is, motive. Or the love for a sport VS money or profit. Noone said anything about giving your mates a pup from the breeding if you choose, but, just because a pup is being intimidated by a sibling is no reason to sale the fecker for some crazy arse price. I see nothing wrong with gifting a terrier to a mate or someone that you know will do what is best for the terrier in mind, And very true Busterdog, I understand that you still have access of the terrier, only if, it was placed with a mate or someone you know will do what is right. But, are any of you honestly attempting to tell me that a terrierman does not assure that he gets the very best from every litter by rearing, and culling through the terriers for himself or his kennels in mind? Who's to say that the only worker in the litter wasn't sold or gifted?? Then where is he at? Back to square one! And as far as Robert Booth, never met the bloke, I just see the shite he peddles via website, messageboards, etc. The claims that are made by him and his followers and the prices that are fetched for his revolutionized breed of patterdale terriers, in my opinion is rubbish. He is in my eyes a peddler, and honestly the best example I can find to give you for a peddler. And from what the lads here say, a thief. Do I know this to be fact?, no sir I do not, he has never stole a terrier from me. I can tell you by email conversation he makes outlandish statements about his supposed famous line of workers, and will sale a terrier for an unreasonable amount faster than a live chicken in Ethiopia. Don't get me wrong, it is not just Booth, there are several website peddlers that fits the same shoe. He is just the most notorius peddler that I know about. I am not having a go with you or anyone for that matter, and all this is merely my opinion and doesn't hold water to anyone but me mate, I respect everyone's opinion that has posted on this thread, can't say I agree with them all, but, I respect them. just my thoughts and figured I'd post the latest peddlers blog. All the best mates.