Guest fence_hopper Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 it all comes down to real dog men they've been inbreeding/linebreeding hundreds of years since any of urs where even put on this planet. how do you think the different breeds of today came about. dawn you on the blob or something he.s a fit healthy dog your welcome to come and see so leave my dog alone so what if you don't agree with line breeding who gives a sh*t what you or anyone else thinks theres more beleivers than not so shut up keep your silly scientific nonsense to your self. oh and thanks for spoiling my thread lucky people no what there looking at i have someone coming to see him on sunday thanks evrybody who has put positive comments up true dog men Link to post Share on other sites
droid 11 Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 Here's my problem, gnasher. I'm not at all convinced that you can breed for behavioural characteristics. I fully accept you can breed for physical characteristics, and maybe the potential to be good at whatever it is you want the dog to do, but I suspect that the ability to do complex tasks (rather than just be aggressive) is probably learned rather than bred for. I also think that anyone who has the time to line-breed for many years to get the dog they want, knows dog training inside out and can spot a dog with 'potential' a mile off. I posed this question on the ferret section ages ago, and received very few relevent answers, so I'll pose it here: how well does a dog that's bred for 'ability' do in the hands of a complete novice? Link to post Share on other sites
Guest fence_hopper Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 The thing is dawnb you are talking about a dogs general health and well being as a pet animal...im not...im talking about the ultimate in sporting prowess in a dog......if that means that in 1 litter 5 dogs are culled and 2 remain alive to become very good sporting dogs then so be it....Im not saying inbreeding is of benefit to the pet dog world...its not we know that.....if i wanted an average run of the mill pet dog to curl up round the fireside then i would not select an inbred animal......if on the other hand i was looking for a top sporting dog i would look at its ped and understand what produced the dog....and if selective inbreeding had taken place i would know why......if that inbred dog then proved himself a good sporting dog also i would have faith in breeding him as i would know WHY he proved a good dog and it wouldnt be luck !... There is a huge difference inbreeding for sport and inbreeding for a pet dog.....im not talking about inbreeding to sell dogs to people or inbreeding to put dogs by the fireside....im talking about inbreeding to create top sporting dogs......it can and does work and its a proven breeding technique when done correctly and very selectively. true dog man, bit of advice mate don't reply to the sh*te coming out of this womens mouth don't lower yourself all the best allan Link to post Share on other sites
Guest fence_hopper Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 Here's my problem, gnasher. I'm not at all convinced that you can breed for behavioural characteristics. I fully accept you can breed for physical characteristics, and maybe the potential to be good at whatever it is you want the dog to do, but I suspect that the ability to do complex tasks (rather than just be aggressive) is probably learned rather than bred for. I also think that anyone who has the time to line-breed for many years to get the dog they want, knows dog training inside out and can spot a dog with 'potential' a mile off. I posed this question on the ferret section ages ago, and received very few relevent answers, so I'll pose it here: how well does a dog that's bred for 'ability' do in the hands of a complete novice? no ones trying to convince you bud no one realy gives a sh*t about you. so listen do it your way breeding shite and leave the true dog men alone oh and while your there get of your arse take your muts for a walk and thanks to another person for ruining my post Link to post Share on other sites
gnasher16 29,602 Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 (edited) Here's my problem, gnasher. I'm not at all convinced that you can breed for behavioural characteristics. I fully accept you can breed for physical characteristics, and maybe the potential to be good at whatever it is you want the dog to do, but I suspect that the ability to do complex tasks (rather than just be aggressive) is probably learned rather than bred for. I also think that anyone who has the time to line-breed for many years to get the dog they want, knows dog training inside out and can spot a dog with 'potential' a mile off. I posed this question on the ferret section ages ago, and received very few relevent answers, so I'll pose it here: how well does a dog that's bred for 'ability' do in the hands of a complete novice? Droid thats a fair question and of course the old Nurture or Nature debate has been raging for years.......firstly id like to add i have no text books to go to ...im certainly not educated enough to read a whole book !!...but i have experienced many years and many generations of family breeding within a strain of dog bred for a purpose and what i would say with hand on heart is inbreeding CAN DEFINATELY produce superior animals when very selectively bred......now as regards behaviour,like i explained before im not particularly interested in a dogs mental behaviour as regards to what you described " the ability to do tasks "....or " training ".....the sport aspect in a young dog should come as natural as tuesday follows monday....IF that is the main criteria of what the dog has been bred for..........yes i agree physical traits are far easier to breed for,we can change the colour of a dogs coat very easily....i disagree, it is certainly possible to breed dogs who are mentally more talented in whatever the chosen field is than dogs who have not been selectively bred....for instance,my father and gr father were builders without too much talent in the brains department......my friends father and gr father were solicitors/barristers.....who is more likely to be intellectually more gifted me or my friend ? i think its obvious...well genetics works the same in animals as it does in people,dogs have brains as well dont they ?.....by nature 1 dog may be a smarter dog than another,if that dog is then inbred and his progeny are selectively inbred.......do you not think down the line these dogs will have a high possibility in being smart dogs ? of course they will thats just nature.....and so this type of dog has the capability to do far more mentally than a dog who is not blessed in the brains department......as for what that is well thats up to the owner,no a dog wont carry your paper home without you showing him first ! Now when it comes to the sporting dog this still applies...many many traits a sporting dog needs are mental....gameness for instance,general smartness and intelligence............so similar to physical, mental traits can still be bred for just the same as if you inbred a chihuaha to a greyhound selectively over several generations you will naturally reduce the size of your strain. I agree the nurture process ( our teachings ) have great value on a dog,but as the old saying go,s......WE CANNOT PUT IN WHAT NATURE LEFT OUT ! Hope this makes some vague sense...its only what i believe and have experienced im not necessarily right......but i dont think im entirely wrong either.....all the best Edited January 14, 2009 by gnasher16 Link to post Share on other sites
countrymaid 2 Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 Does nobody breed dual purpose whippets these days, i specialise in breeding whippets that can do a days/nights work and are also good pets maybe good show dogs. Just changing the subject a little about inbreeding, you lot should see some of the local farming families around here im not naming any names but they are certanly inbred with alot of inherited problems. I was told years ago by one of the old farmers when choosing a wife, it was where you could get to there and back in a day with a horse and cart that determined which wife they chose so what would you lot say 20 miles maybe less so you can see what i mean about the local gene pool around here. Link to post Share on other sites
gnasher16 29,602 Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 I was told years ago by one of the old farmers when choosing a wife, it was where you could get to there and back in a day with a horse and cart that determined which wife they chose so what would you lot say 20 miles maybe less so you can see what i mean about the local gene pool around here. Sounds perfectly fair to me....its just that 7 fingers on 1 hand buiseness that puts me off.....makes your willy look small Link to post Share on other sites
ljs1984 3 Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 F**k Me, hes only trying to sell his whippet! cant a man sell a dog these days! My whippet has sooty sam in it 11 times from what i can see from the whippet archives and she is 10 month old at the moment and showing a very high prey drive and a lot of potential! http://thewhippetarchives.net/details.php?...3948&gens=7 Link to post Share on other sites
Dawn B 212 Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 Fence-Hopper, why have you got such a rude attitude? Nobody has been rude to you have they? All have had a reasonably civil conversation and you come in gung ho!! Really no need for it and after all, its bringing YOUR sale to the top each time folk log on! Link to post Share on other sites
Guest little lurcher Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 Does nobody breed dual purpose whippets these days, i specialise in breeding whippets that can do a days/nights work and are also good pets maybe good show dogs. Just changing the subject a little about inbreeding, you lot should see some of the local farming families around here im not naming any names but they are certanly inbred with alot of inherited problems. I was told years ago by one of the old farmers when choosing a wife, it was where you could get to there and back in a day with a horse and cart that determined which wife they chose so what would you lot say 20 miles maybe less so you can see what i mean about the local gene pool around here. yes they do as this is what i do , i bred sound working whippets that are good enough to stand their ground at shows , the litter i have at min both parents are crufts qualified and various wins at open level , as well as lure coursing stakes winners and demons on the lamp , both work to ferrets also , the two parents are found in my gallery danny and jessie, my dogs have exceptional temperements and a joy to live and work with Link to post Share on other sites
the fezz 44 Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 good luck with the sale F.H , its from good working lines this pup ,hope he finds a good working home Link to post Share on other sites
Guest fence_hopper Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 Fence-Hopper, why have you got such a rude attitude? Nobody has been rude to you have they? All have had a reasonably civil conversation and you come in gung ho!! Really no need for it and after all, its bringing YOUR sale to the top each time folk log on! well why do you think? i was of line for abit came back your slating my dogs pedigree thinking your a scientist or more specific god if someone wanted your opion on line breeding they would ask, i didn't want a debate which you have cuased so thanks for your unrelevent information on breeding dogs i think next time you should think before saying anything you've obviosly got a big mouth and have something to prove. and if you met me we most probably would get on grate, i just get abit annoyed with people on here thinking they know everything Link to post Share on other sites
Dawn B 212 Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 I asked because I didnt know, at NO time have I been rude to you, its when people start being abusive, that threads get locked and mods feel like packing it all in. The fact remains about inbreeding, if it suits you fine, but it still causes problems for dogs whether owners choose to acknowledge it or not. By the way, have you managed to find him a home? If so you could say its because of me! Link to post Share on other sites
gnasher16 29,602 Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 The fact remains about inbreeding, if it suits you fine, but it still causes problems for dogs whether owners choose to acknowledge it or not. Dawn i do acknowledge that inbreeding can cause problems and thats why selection is so important...........but you must also acknowledge that inbreeding can also produce some superb animals who if not for inbreeding would not have been as good. Im not dragging this out i just think folk need to be willing to try things before writing them off as bad......i agree there was never any need for this thread to get silly and insulting after all we are all learning off each other and listening to opinions,we dont have to agree with them but still good to hear them. Link to post Share on other sites
asha 48 Posted January 14, 2009 Report Share Posted January 14, 2009 i love whippets to bits and know by looking at him he has good blood lines as he has a good strong shoulders and nicer butt than j-lo lol!!! on a serious side he is a very nice lookng dog if he was a bitch we might have thought about him. Link to post Share on other sites
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