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toxo

17HH bench clean up.

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Very much a work in progress. A mixture of cases, COAL, etc. Just looking for powder to go forward with.

The question is, why are the Trail Boss holes smaller than the others? (bottom of the page)

4th Dec 2017 181.JPG

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Hi toxo would it not be easier to find a decent load for one bullet head/powder combo first, working up the load, or are you just trying to save time and get lucky using this method.

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15 minutes ago, IanB said:

Hi toxo would it not be easier to find a decent load for one bullet head/powder combo first, working up the load, or are you just trying to save time and get lucky using this method.

It really was to clear things up. Those loads have been accrued over time. As you know there is little info out there for the 17gr pill and if you ask ten different forums a question you'll get ten different answers. Some swear by Lilgun whilst others won't touch it, etc etc. What I want to end up with is a medium range quiet load and full load for "normal" ranges. At £5.50 per 100 for the 17gr Vmax I won't discard it until I know it won't do what I want it to do.

Until recently I've only been getting out once a week and then for a limited time. That's changed now and I can put in full days through the week so the developing will begin in earnest and I've just confirmed with my FEO that I can use my nearest perm for the Hornet which will cut the travelling time in half.

I know that the groups on that target will reduce drastically when I make sure that all cases and seating are the same and I've worked out what the "jump" should be.

Now that I've done that little excercise I'll choose the best and go on from there. I'll even be taking the F1 Chrony which hasn't seen the light of day for months.

It seems no-one has an answer for the size of the holes. My guess is that there's some wobbling going on. Either they're just not stable with that combination or they were to begin with and became unstable at some time before 100yds.

 

 

 

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On ‎05‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 22:39, toxo said:

It really was to clear things up. Those loads have been accrued over time. As you know there is little info out there for the 17gr pill and if you ask ten different forums a question you'll get ten different answers. Some swear by Lilgun whilst others won't touch it, etc etc. What I want to end up with is a medium range quiet load and full load for "normal" ranges. At £5.50 per 100 for the 17gr Vmax I won't discard it until I know it won't do what I want it to do.

Until recently I've only been getting out once a week and then for a limited time. That's changed now and I can put in full days through the week so the developing will begin in earnest and I've just confirmed with my FEO that I can use my nearest perm for the Hornet which will cut the travelling time in half.

I know that the groups on that target will reduce drastically when I make sure that all cases and seating are the same and I've worked out what the "jump" should be.

Now that I've done that little excercise I'll choose the best and go on from there. I'll even be taking the F1 Chrony which hasn't seen the light of day for months.

It seems no-one has an answer for the size of the holes. My guess is that there's some wobbling going on. Either they're just not stable with that combination or they were to begin with and became unstable at some time before 100yds.

 

 

 

Alright Toxo?

Just as a guide (;)) ... I'm running 12.0 grains of DO63 out of my 17 hornet, pushing Hornady 25 grain HPs. 3425 fps and a single ragged hole at 100 metres.

My advice would be - 1) Select the bullet weight that you feel is best suited to you shooting requirements, 2) Use your selection of powders to find the one that the bullet/barrel combination likes.

Having too many parameters in your tests will never yield the results that you are looking for, and it will ultimately drive you mad. :yes: . I've been there. ;)

Edited by Tremo

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The bullet is very slow in the trail boss load, the paper has some time to move out of the way somewhat.

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On 12/7/2017 at 06:24, Tremo said:

Alright Toxo?

Just as a guide (;)) ... I'm running 12.0 grains of DO63 out of my 17 hornet, pushing Hornady 25 grain HPs. 3425 fps and a single ragged hole at 100 metres.

My advice would be - 1) Select the bullet weight that you feel is best suited to you shooting requirements, 2) Use your selection of powders to find the one that the bullet/barrel combination likes.

Having too many parameters in your tests will never yield the results that you are looking for, and it will ultimately drive you mad. :yes: . I've been there. ;)

I'm with Tremo, find a projectile weight work on that with a chosen powder, find a sweet spot. Then work on a TB sweetspot.

I strongly suspect the light projectile is stabilising better at the lower velocity through your barrel twist rate.

I had a similar thing with a newer Savage in .223, the heavier 62gn projectiles shot better than the 50 - 55gn until I dropped the velocity for the lighter projectiles. The opposite in my early Rem 700 .223, 52gn is the sweet weight, any heavier projectiles and they are all over the place.

I have never dropped lower than 20gn in any of my 17 cal centerfires, and they all prefer the 25gn'ers.

Yes, I have masses of left over test loads, good for plinking at tin cans and dirt clumps for an afternoon with friends, I could not be bothered pulling them apart and possibly mixing powders by mistake.

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9 hours ago, 17hornet said:

I'm with Tremo, find a projectile weight work on that with a chosen powder, find a sweet spot. Then work on a TB sweetspot.

I agree and now that I've cleared the also rans things are a lot clearer  but I do have all the bullet weights (including 300 30gr Berger HP) and three brands of powder to be played with later.

I believe TB is on the "REACH" list. Maybe someone will come up with an alternative but even if they don't, two or three 9oz bottles will see me out. IIRC there's about 4600grains in a bottle and if only around 2.5gr is used........!

I strongly suspect the light projectile is stabilising better at the lower velocity through your barrel twist rate.

Makes much sense.

I had a similar thing with a newer Savage in .223, the heavier 62gn projectiles shot better than the 50 - 55gn until I dropped the velocity for the lighter projectiles. The opposite in my early Rem 700 .223, 52gn is the sweet weight, any heavier projectiles and they are all over the place.

I have never dropped lower than 20gn in any of my 17 cal centerfires, and they all prefer the 25gn'ers.

It stands to reason that the heavier bullet will be better over distance and wind but I don't shoot distance. The reason I went for the 17HH is the versatility of having different rounds for different jobs.

Picking up rabbits with no or very little head is getting old and the trauma often goes into the meat. The idea of having a light bullet with a lower velocity and less noise than HMR gets my juices running.

Of course we'll carry "normal" loads for when distance is needed and of course for Reynard.

Yes, I have masses of left over test loads, good for plinking at tin cans and dirt clumps for an afternoon with friends, I could not be bothered pulling them apart and possibly mixing powders by mistake.

Not having a puller, I came up with a good idea! I have a keyless drill chuck such as you find in cordless drills. Place cartridge in shell holder with no die in place. Raise the cartridge to the top, attach the chuck to the bullet and lower the cartridge (although at this point it isn't a cartridge any more cos it's got no head).

 

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LOL, I reckon you just invented the 'all cal' collet bullet puller there Toxo, I use Lee collet bullet pullers but have not seen one in .17 so yours does make sense. Ta for that :hmm:

I could save bullets, but hate the thought of mixing powders by accident so just use them up, or if a load is too hot, spill the powder onto the lawn for fertiliser and begin a-new.

4 powders here for the .17 AH - , IMR, WIN, ADI, + Trailboss - only 2x bullet weights - lucky me  :thumbs:

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