gonetoearth 5,144 Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 SCENT I've asked opinions over the years of many huntsmen and learned hunt followers of note what conditions make for the best scent weather hail rain and snow , hot or warm weather , time of year breeding time pairing up time etc etc , many answers have been given over the years and when you think up in the lakes and mountains of Wales all four seasons can come and go in the course of a days hunting it makes scent all the more interesting , certain types of ground , grass , stubble, heather, woodland fallen leafs etc all in my opinion add and detract from scent holding , but for me it the hounds ability to track scent that is the main factor this is through centuries of breeding the best to the best a close circle of packs stud hounds whos names appear in stud books through out the packs of the uk and the hunting world be it old English, modern, welsh , hill, fell, the carefull breeding of these hounds has improved their scenting ability , heal or back scenting is all part of a hounds learning curve as is stock breaking and being whipped in off hare and rioting on deer this is all down to the hunt staff the fox hound is without doubt a machine it's ability to track over miles of different terrain in all weathers some times they fail but they are not robots the mystery of scent is just that a mystery but the fox hound has the code on most occasions and there is no better sight or sound than a pack in full cry GTE 1 Quote Link to post
paulus 26 Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 i walk a twat of a jack russell dog for an old couple twice a day, that dog knows from 50 yrds away if the dog comming the other way is a breeding age entire male, i kid you not if its an old dog or a bitch hes completly normal but if its a young entire dog he starts to stalk it on the lead from 50yrds further if the winds in the right direction all from air scent. so i would say with confidence he can tell sex and age Quote Link to post
weasle 1,119 Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 Moo im afraid your wrong, again. It was infact emmerdale,it must have been a thought prevoking episode as i also came across the thought of how similar you are to sam dingle, spookly similar Weasle the foxs definatly seam to have the ability to suck up there scent when headed/shot at. I guess its the same as the vixen uses to reduce the amount of scent she amits through cubbing. So why do we think this is? Do they have the ability to switch off there scent glads and after being headed etc only leave a line from the vegitation / earth they disturb, hence the sudden failer of being able to take the line on as they had just a minute previous? If they could turn of there scent,they would do it as soon as they knew they were be hunted..(maybe).But if there bodies can stop giving of scent why havnt they evolved to stop as soon as they know there being hunted? If fox hounds were move efficent would you would end up with foxs that dont give of scent. Quote Link to post
Bootsha 1,306 Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 I reckon if you could only bottle the sound of a pack in full cry and take that into a hospital ward, take the lid of it and let it ooooze out into the ward for all to hear, the recovery rates in all our hospitals would increase tenfold, near to dead 'uns would sit up and take notice. Theres nothing on gods good earth quite like it, and i mean NOTHING (until you get 'er yacks off lol ) B 1 Quote Link to post
MUDD 374 Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) How many packs in the Uk and Ireland would of/do stick to they're hunted quarry when a fresh un jumps in front of them, but unsighted, and either runs the line or just flashes that of the hunted................. ? Good question !!! Very tricky one to answer also, as it can go either way depending on the cover being hunted and weather also. most DECENT hounds I've seen working would follow on the main, younger dogs would tend to do the obvious. It's hard to tell, though if your standing around cover waiting for a break (in Ireland) with a few lads working there hounds together, it's not hard to tell after a few bits off cover who's hounds are on the ball and who's are not just as HOT. Great thread lads Edited March 1, 2012 by MUDD Quote Link to post
alimac 882 Posted March 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Its a difficult one, Id say most packs would split to some degree, but its only really when they split that you know another fox is afoot, how many times would it be known they had crossed the fresh line of another fox other than the one being hunted unless they split?? especially in country that is blessed with bigger blocks of cover were they can be hunting a good while before anything is viewed. 1 Quote Link to post
dogs-n-natives 1,181 Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 My brain hurts... nice read Ali, thought provoking stuff. About the pack splitting when a fresh fox is lifted, seen it many times, surely both scent trails being just as attractive..?. but would some foxes seem more attractive to them than others? Would certain individual hounds prefer to stay on the original fox or do hounds just follow their nose as best they can, taking the line that happens to lead them away from the other line, being stronger, or maybe just luck as to which scent particles hit their sensors first? As the pack follow the scent in a wide pattern it makes sense that as the two lines of fox scent split some hounds will hit one line, and the other hounds taking the second line... I dont think as humans we can ever appreciate the nose of a hound, truly amazing. 1 Quote Link to post
lunita 57 Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 love this topic..its really interesting..i dont think we will ever understand scent in the same way as a hound does..i rember reading in a book once that a dog can still smell a human scent on a piece of grass days later..its really interesting. I saw a pack split once they were hunting a fox from a cover went few fielddlengths into another cover and i was stood in the field and saw 3 deer emerge with the fox running same line then the fox split and ran up the side of field to make a get away ..he used the deer as cover and most of ppack followed them. Is that because the deer have a stronger secnt or is it due to bad training on the hunts part of the hounds? Quote Link to post
paulus 26 Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 love this topic..its really interesting..i dont think we will ever understand scent in the same way as a hound does..i rember reading in a book once that a dog can still smell a human scent on a piece of grass days later..its really interesting. I saw a pack split once they were hunting a fox from a cover went few fielddlengths into another cover and i was stood in the field and saw 3 deer emerge with the fox running same line then the fox split and ran up the side of field to make a get away ..he used the deer as cover and most of ppack followed them. Is that because the deer have a stronger secnt or is it due to bad training on the hunts part of the hounds? or due to a mixture of scents did they carry on following the deer? Quote Link to post
lunita 57 Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 love this topic..its really interesting..i dont think we will ever understand scent in the same way as a hound does..i rember reading in a book once that a dog can still smell a human scent on a piece of grass days later..its really interesting. I saw a pack split once they were hunting a fox from a cover went few fielddlengths into another cover and i was stood in the field and saw 3 deer emerge with the fox running same line then the fox split and ran up the side of field to make a get away ..he used the deer as cover and most of ppack followed them. Is that because the deer have a stronger secnt or is it due to bad training on the hunts part of the hounds? or due to a mixture of scents did they carry on following the deer? yeah most of pack did and really strong cry ...was really hard to get them off...bout 20 mins later i saw the fox coming back out of cover it went to and down field it came from ..lol.clever bugger it was. Quote Link to post
paulus 26 Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 love this topic..its really interesting..i dont think we will ever understand scent in the same way as a hound does..i rember reading in a book once that a dog can still smell a human scent on a piece of grass days later..its really interesting. I saw a pack split once they were hunting a fox from a cover went few fielddlengths into another cover and i was stood in the field and saw 3 deer emerge with the fox running same line then the fox split and ran up the side of field to make a get away ..he used the deer as cover and most of ppack followed them. Is that because the deer have a stronger secnt or is it due to bad training on the hunts part of the hounds? or due to a mixture of scents did they carry on following the deer? yeah most of pack did and really strong cry ...was really hard to get them off...bout 20 mins later i saw the fox coming back out of cover it went to and down field it came from ..lol.clever bugger it was. we both no the answer then 1 Quote Link to post
alimac 882 Posted March 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 love this topic..its really interesting..i dont think we will ever understand scent in the same way as a hound does..i rember reading in a book once that a dog can still smell a human scent on a piece of grass days later..its really interesting. I saw a pack split once they were hunting a fox from a cover went few fielddlengths into another cover and i was stood in the field and saw 3 deer emerge with the fox running same line then the fox split and ran up the side of field to make a get away ..he used the deer as cover and most of ppack followed them. Is that because the deer have a stronger secnt or is it due to bad training on the hunts part of the hounds? If they left a fox and took on the roe they shouldnt be in the kennel, probably due to not being entered well enough, you might expect it once or twice with a first/second season hound thats a bit too sharp and thinks it knows it all, but for the majority to do so is bad form.. I think im right in saying the deer scent is stronger to a dog than that of a fox (how the found that out im not sure) but is still no excuse I saw on sky, i think a belgium malinwa (sp) tracing a scent of a old boy that was missing, he had been missing for days and if i remember right almost a week, from a sniff of his clothes, it tracked through housing complexs,across busy roads and eventually to a fishing peg on a river, where his clothes had been found in the first few days, he was later found downstream. Now if a dogs nose can do that then it can do anything.. Quote Link to post
gonetoearth 5,144 Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Some people do not understand the effort that goes into a pack from pup to entering , hound pup sent to be walked and socialised by puppy walkers mixing with children and other dogs cats etc , stock breaking big hunts have sheep pens , cats on the yard etc all building to the hound pup joining exercise with the full pack , any hounds rioting on deer will not be tolerated some may get a second chance but as this may encourage less experienced hounds to follow suit they would be retired , well trained hound are a sight to be hold , trained to the horn and voice , but like other things in life the are Huntsmen and there are people who have hounds 4 Quote Link to post
turkish 285 Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 Moo im afraid your wrong, again. It was infact emmerdale,it must have been a thought prevoking episode as i also came across the thought of how similar you are to sam dingle, spookly similar Weasle the foxs definatly seam to have the ability to suck up there scent when headed/shot at. I guess its the same as the vixen uses to reduce the amount of scent she amits through cubbing. So why do we think this is? Do they have the ability to switch off there scent glads and after being headed etc only leave a line from the vegitation / earth they disturb, hence the sudden failer of being able to take the line on as they had just a minute previous? are you saying when vixens are cubbing they give less scent if so i then i think thats very interesting another survival instinct of old charlie boy/ girl.great thread by the way Quote Link to post
lunita 57 Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 Moo im afraid your wrong, again. It was infact emmerdale,it must have been a thought prevoking episode as i also came across the thought of how similar you are to sam dingle, spookly similar Weasle the foxs definatly seam to have the ability to suck up there scent when headed/shot at. I guess its the same as the vixen uses to reduce the amount of scent she amits through cubbing. So why do we think this is? Do they have the ability to switch off there scent glads and after being headed etc only leave a line from the vegitation / earth they disturb, hence the sudden failer of being able to take the line on as they had just a minute previous? are you saying when vixens are cubbing they give less scent if so i then i think thats very interesting another survival instinct of old charlie boy/ girl.great thread by the way ive definatly heard that before that vixens dont lay a scent when they are in cub..dont know if is true but most of the old time hunters believed and said it as i was growing up and it does make sense. Quote Link to post
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