Rake aboot 4,929 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 jerks !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Reprobate. if you don`t mind! Or General of the "Band of Idiots" if you want to be formal. Actually Rake aboot, you're a reet honourable delinquent Oh,, I`m welling up,, me old mum would be so proud ! I`ll give you the BS call though,, fair play !lol ATB Quote Link to post
The Duncan 802 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Lmao mate Quote Link to post
The Seeker 3,048 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Ahem....Gents back to the topic in hand, I accept some use the HMR for fox but let's not forget one important issue many Police Firearms depts will not issue fox on .22 or HMR as they don't consider is suitable. SO reaching into my cabinet for a night foxing I would go for the .223 not only because I think it is a better calibre for the job but to take a rim fire would be illegal in South Yorkshire. Don't you just love a standard approach? Which got me thinking if a guy from Derbyshire has fox on his rimmy and shoots foxes in South Yorkshire (just over the border for those not blessed with Yorkshire blood) would he be committing an offence if he gets a pull from the Police? Quote Link to post
The Duncan 802 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Good question! Here's another. On my ticket it says 'for ground game, vermin and all legal quarry' So by home office definition, is fox covered? Quote Link to post
tegater 789 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 No because he is authorised to use it for fox, provided of course the land is on his ticket or he as an open ticket. Quote Link to post
tegater 789 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Good question! Here's another. On my ticket it says 'for ground game, vermin and all legal quarry' So by home office definition, is fox covered? According to a recent BASC magazine, fox falls under the LEGAL definition of vermin. It would therefore be unlikely any prosecution would succeed. The other thing to consider is that a firearm certificate doesn't stipulate that the fox, CANNOT be shot with a hmr, or .22. Quote Link to post
tegater 789 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 The other thing to consider is that everybody has a right to protect their property. (livestock/gamebirds) So again if a .22 is the only gun immediately available, and as already hinted at somewhere else, a brick could be legally used if necessary, I cannot envisage any feo, being anything other than "a reasonable man/woman). Quote Link to post
The Seeker 3,048 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Good question! Here's another. On my ticket it says 'for ground game, vermin and all legal quarry' So by home office definition, is fox covered? According to a recent BASC magazine, fox falls under the LEGAL definition of vermin. It would therefore be unlikely any prosecution would succeed. The other thing to consider is that a firearm certificate doesn't stipulate that the fox, CANNOT be shot with a hmr, or .22. No it doesn't but it also doesn't say you can't shoot wild boar with it either, yes I know this is an exaggeration but I don't think that could be used as a defence, I was told clearly by my FAO SY Police do not allow the use of rimmy on fox... Just shows how there is a lack of standardisation, .222 and up for Roe deer in Scotland but .240 minimum calibre in England WHY? Are the deer south of the border harder than in the north I don't think so. This is my point re the Derbyshire/S Yorks debate could a guy from Scotland argue he has deer on his .222 so therefore he can shoot deer in herts?????? (edited to say I am aware CWD and Muntjac can be shot by .222 in England before anyone makes the point) Quote Link to post
tegater 789 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Good question! Here's another. On my ticket it says 'for ground game, vermin and all legal quarry' So by home office definition, is fox covered? According to a recent BASC magazine, fox falls under the LEGAL definition of vermin. It would therefore be unlikely any prosecution would succeed. The other thing to consider is that a firearm certificate doesn't stipulate that the fox, CANNOT be shot with a hmr, or .22. No it doesn't but it also doesn't say you can't shoot wild boar with it either, yes I know this is an exaggeration but I don't think that could be used as a defence, I was told clearly by my FAO SY Police do not allow the use of rimmy on fox... Just shows how there is a lack of standardisation, .222 and up for Roe deer in Scotland but .240 minimum calibre in England WHY? Are the deer south of the border harder than in the north I don't think so. This is my point re the Derbyshire/S Yorks debate could a guy from Scotland argue he has deer on his .222 so therefore he can shoot deer in herts?????? Deer are specifically covered by an act of law. Quote Link to post
Rake aboot 4,929 Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 There are minmum legal requirements for calibres used on deer. There are NONE on fox, If the shot is humane and safe then take it. simples.. And HMR will knock the living shite out of a fox if it hits it correctly so whats the issue, Glad we don`t have all that conditioned for this and that malarky up here,, Quote Link to post
Guest cookiemonsterandmerlin Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) Well iam 48 years old duncan i work with fire arms everyday and have done for the last 20 years prior to that i was shooting air rifles and shotguns. i make custom loads for my employers and have designed bullets for special forces use. .17 IS NOT A FOXING CALIBRE. Dont you mean special loads for special people AKA in your world ATB Cookie Edited January 24, 2012 by cookiemonsterandmerlin 1 Quote Link to post
Deker 3,450 Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 Ahem....Gents back to the topic in hand, I accept some use the HMR for fox but let's not forget one important issue many Police Firearms depts will not issue fox on .22 or HMR as they don't consider is suitable. SO reaching into my cabinet for a night foxing I would go for the .223 not only because I think it is a better calibre for the job but to take a rim fire would be illegal in South Yorkshire. Don't you just love a standard approach? Which got me thinking if a guy from Derbyshire has fox on his rimmy and shoots foxes in South Yorkshire (just over the border for those not blessed with Yorkshire blood) would he be committing an offence if he gets a pull from the Police? No, and that just underlines the stupidity of the system! Quote Link to post
Deker 3,450 Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) Good question! Here's another. On my ticket it says 'for ground game, vermin and all legal quarry' So by home office definition, is fox covered? According to a recent BASC magazine, fox falls under the LEGAL definition of vermin. It would therefore be unlikely any prosecution would succeed. The other thing to consider is that a firearm certificate doesn't stipulate that the fox, CANNOT be shot with a hmr, or .22. No it doesn't but it also doesn't say you can't shoot wild boar with it either, yes I know this is an exaggeration but I don't think that could be used as a defence, I was told clearly by my FAO SY Police do not allow the use of rimmy on fox... Just shows how there is a lack of standardisation, .222 and up for Roe deer in Scotland but .240 minimum calibre in England WHY? Are the deer south of the border harder than in the north I don't think so. This is my point re the Derbyshire/S Yorks debate could a guy from Scotland argue he has deer on his .222 so therefore he can shoot deer in herts?????? (edited to say I am aware CWD and Muntjac can be shot by .222 in England before anyone makes the point) As my post above, it doesn't matter what SY allow, I could visit with a Thames Valley FAC and stand next to you and shoot foxes legally! Edited January 24, 2012 by Deker Quote Link to post
Deker 3,450 Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) Good question! Here's another. On my ticket it says 'for ground game, vermin and all legal quarry' So by home office definition, is fox covered? The wording is usually ALL LAWFUL QUARRY, but if thats what your FAC says then YES! :yes: According to a recent BASC magazine, fox falls under the LEGAL definition of vermin. It would therefore be unlikely any prosecution would succeed. The other thing to consider is that a firearm certificate doesn't stipulate that the fox, CANNOT be shot with a hmr, or .22. No it doesn't but it also doesn't say you can't shoot wild boar with it either, yes I know this is an exaggeration but I don't think that could be used as a defence, I was told clearly by my FAO SY Police do not allow the use of rimmy on fox... Just shows how there is a lack of standardisation, .222 and up for Roe deer in Scotland but .240 minimum calibre in England WHY? Are the deer south of the border harder than in the north I don't think so. This is my point re the Derbyshire/S Yorks debate could a guy from Scotland argue he has ROE deer on his .222 so therefore he can shoot ROE deer in herts?????? NO, there are seperate Deer Acts governing each "country", as opposed to a whim of any police region. I have a condition on my Thames Valley FAC that specifically states I can use my .223 on Roe in Scotland. That still remains illegal in England and Wales. Whilst I too agree this is stupid, and the deer fall down just the same we are talking different Deer Acts here! (edited to say I am aware CWD and Muntjac can be shot by .222 in England before anyone makes the point) Edited January 24, 2012 by Deker Quote Link to post
TWOTWOTHREE 152 Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 A mate lives in south Yorkshire and his firearms department said no to fox with the rimmys end of, 10 miles my way in derby's I can with 22 and 17 and states in print fox at the side of each cal Listed along with ground game etc etc Also was told that if I travelled to his neck of the woods I can shoot them as it's stated on my open ticket, Ps I still think the 17 is a mint close range fox calibre, Atb Quote Link to post
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