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boar dog breeds


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#46 lampinglurcher

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 06:48 pm

my neighbor has one, very athletic, can jump ridiculously highbut has a stupidly undershot jaw! looks like its been suckin something too long..... :11:

#47 bullsmilk

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 07:08 pm

every boxer ive seen has been dopey as fook....but wernt they a german hunting dog????

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 10:14 pm

every boxer ive seen has been dopey as fook....but wernt they a german hunting dog????


"In a nut shell"
Yes mate they were, first bred in germany they spred around the world pretty quickly. They were bred for hunting boar and bear, they were also used for personal protection and in circus acts :icon_eek: They are a mix of an old german bull breed called Bullenbeisser and English bull dog, hence the over shot lower jaw.

Incidently, i read in a book somewhere that boxers provided the foundations for the mastiff which was later crossed with a running dog to produce the great dane.

Edited by BLUE BULL, 11 September 2006 - 10:25 pm.


#49 kiwi

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 10:49 pm

as far as i knew the modern day boxer was a butchers dog, the white boxer is a legacy of the introduction of the english bulldog "tom". a well bred boxer is far from stupid and lazy. they do have a bloody good nose though, strange for a breed that has an undershot jaw.

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 10:54 am

as far as i knew the modern day boxer was a butchers dog.


Im confused by the butchers dog, I have read loads on boxers but im confused as some books led me to believe the butchers dog was an olde breed, and others led me to believe its just a job description so to speak.

Edited by BLUE BULL, 12 September 2006 - 10:57 am.


#51 Stabs

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 11:06 am

[attachment=5864:attachment]

Pics of old boxers....


I was under the impression that there were a number of what you could term bullenbeisers, varying in size and function and when the KC Bulldog was added you effectively got the Boxer. Some GD in there too?

Butchers dog in the terms we are talking about is more a term describing a job ie. a dray dog for pulling carts. Hence the old name for the Rotty, which is Rottweil Metzgerhund (metzger means butcher).

#52 kiwi

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 11:32 am

so the boxer was a working bulldog then. :icon_eek:

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 11:33 am

I was under the impression that there were a number of what you could term bullenbeisers, varying in size and function and when the KC Bulldog was added you effectively got the Boxer. Some GD in there too?

Butchers dog in the terms we are talking about is more a term describing a job ie. a dray dog for pulling carts. Hence the old name for the Rotty, which is Rottweil Metzgerhund (metzger means butcher).


I got it wrong in my last post boxers are decendents of GD's not the other way round as i first thought, boxers came from the brabanter bullunbeisser (bullenbeisser means bull biter which as you said stabs covers many dogs!), The brabanter bullenbeiser used to create boxers was a belgian dog not german.

Edited by BLUE BULL, 12 September 2006 - 11:39 am.


#54 Stabs

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 11:34 am

The forerunner to it certainly was mate

#55 bullmastiff

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 02:34 pm

[/quote]
the boxer has an under shoot jaw and cant hold.
[/quote]

I was led to believe the undershot jaw and shortened muzzle was to improve grip and jaw power not lessen it? fair enough with some it's far too undershot it be much use but anything up to 1cm gap between front top and bottom teeth is usually still ok, and i believe it's not the bottom jaw thats longer, it's the top jaw which is shorter hence a lot of bull breeds suffering with extended soft palates (palate stays the same size and is just moved further back in the skull)

#56 lampinglurcher

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 02:47 pm

[quote name='bullmastiff' date='Sep 12 2006, 03:34 PM' post='122836']
[/quote]
the boxer has an under shoot jaw and cant hold.
[/quote]

I was led to believe the undershot jaw and shortened muzzle was to improve grip and jaw power not lessen it? fair enough with some it's far too undershot it be much use but anything up to 1cm gap between front top and bottom teeth is usually still ok, and i believe it's not the bottom jaw thats longer, it's the top jaw which is shorter hence a lot of bull breeds suffering with extended soft palates (palate stays the same size and is just moved further back in the skull)
[/quote]

doesnt the overshot jaw make it harder to breathe when its holding?
kiwi, have you ever worked a boxer?

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 08:03 pm

Never had the pleasure of watching a Boxer works hogs or do any form of hunting, but I’ve worked a few in bite work and their grips (how they bite the sleeve or suit is judged in the protection sports) tend to suffer. We had one that was dynamite where his attitude and drive was concerned and if I was going to hunt with one, he definitely deserved serious consideration. Problem was, he had a lot of trouble getting a good grip on anything and it was only through sheer determination and the dogs’ work ethic that he became a respectable performer.
I know that biting a suit or sleeve isn’t like catching a hog and the dogs aren’t being graded for the quality of the bite in a hunting situation, at least not by some judge. But they are being graded by a hog that can and will do some serious damage if the dog can’t get and keep control.
I’d like to hear about some good stock (in any country) if anyone has experience with them.

I gotta agree with Kiwi, some of the best tracking dogs I’ve seen are Boxers.

A young dog we were working until he blew his knee out. The reason for all the long line (the long leash) work was so that once he got a good bite, the owner would make him work to keep it.

[attachment=5881:attachment]

[attachment=5882:attachment]

Gregg

#58 kiwi

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 09:36 pm

yeah i have used a number of boxers on pigs, all bitches though, the bitch i have here has seen enough pigs to know they are great fun to catch, she is worth to much as a breeding bitch to continue as a pigdog to me, i have a mate who paid alot of money for a bitch that was killed in action as well. only biting the sleave is not really a problem as the pigs ears is [BANNED TEXT] a good holding dog will grab hold of anyway. the boxers jaw really is the weak spot but some lines of boxers have bigger muzzles than others, my jade has a hard bite that she has passed on to her pups. the scott line ambulls are very similar to a good boxer, but like all things american alot bigger. if i was hunting pigs in aussie and needed a line of ute finding catch dogs a scottx boxer is the type i would use, dogo being the first choice of course. :D

#59 Guest_Gregg Barrow_*

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 10:22 pm

Kiwi,

The Scott line? Is that the smaller more athletic ones that I’ve seen?
The American Bulldog guys here are big into their Iron Dog/Catch dog and Weight pull competitions.
The only dogs that I’ve worked are what they called “Johnson”Bred.
But another guy that I know, Francis Metcalf, has a French Ring (another sport) American Bulldog (Gubby), and he looks just like a large brindle Pit-bull, so I’m assuming that would be Scott bred?

I seriously have no clue. I like the AB guys, they send me a lot of work and have helped out with hunting grounds, but I have yet to see one of the Johnson bred dogs that I would own (nothing wrong with the dogs, they just don’t suit me) Then I saw Gubby and he looks nothing like the rest. One of the guys called him “show bred”.

Trying to buy an education here so I can dazzle them with my (your :) ) knowledge at the next show.

Best,
Gregg

#60 kiwi

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 10:43 pm

yeah the scott is the leggy version, i am no expert on the bred or lines, i do own a ambull but he's a hybrid johnsonxscott. most of the ambulls we have in aussie and nz are johnson line or type, why the johnson has become so popular is over my head, a working pigdog in my eyes must be able to run and the johnson is just a big oversized pile of muscle that has no place in the nz bush :no: great pets though. the working scott ambull is a handy looking dog, the movie homeward bound sold me on the breed. i think the johnson line was bred to look more like a bulldog where as the scott line has not changed much from the bulldogs bought over in the early days from the uk. i do like the ambull they are very smart dogs.




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