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ellir0305

becoming a first time owner

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i am looking into getting a dog for the first time i am torn between either an ESS or patterdale.

 

i want a working animal that can flush cover to a gun, retrieve and be of use on a days ferreting, that is marking holes and standing guard.

 

there are a few things i need to know as i realise how serious taking on a dog is, the dog will live outside in a run, what size should this be and the dog will be walked at least once but mostly twice a day.

 

is a diet of dry complete working dog food acceptable or should a raw diet be given?

 

Am i on the right lines of breed or do you have any other suggestions ?

 

does pet insurance cover the necessary parts for working dogs or is there a special typ of insurance as i would not like to be in a position where i could not cover vets bill?

we have plenty of space in the countryside and unting is really my main hobby so work for the dog would be plentiful,

 

thanks in advance

 

atb rob

Edited by ellir0305

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i am looking into getting a dog for the first time i am torn between either an ESS or patterdale.

 

i want a working animal that can flush cover to a gun, retrieve and be of use on a days ferreting, that is marking holes and standing guard.

 

there are a few things i need to know as i realise how serious taking on a dog is, the dog will live outside in a run, what size should this be and the dog will be walked at least once but mostly twice a day.

 

is a diet of dry complete working dog food acceptable or should a raw diet be given?

 

Am i on the right lines of breed or do you have any other suggestions ?

 

does pet insurance cover the necessary parts for working dogs or is there a special typ of insurance as i would not like to be in a position where i could not cover vets bill?

we have plenty of space in the countryside and unting is really my main hobby so work for the dog would be plentiful,

 

thanks in advance

 

atb rob

 

i wouldnt recomend a ess for your 1st dog mate there nuts used to be a keeper so ive trained the nutters before. avoid the spaniels have a cocker at the mo an its mental too. a patt would do the job as long as it was from good working stock(no show dogs at all) although they can be a bit hard and head strong a wee beddyxwhippet would do the job mate or even a colliexwhip which i would prefer, bit more bra

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cheers, my mate has a 9 yr old colliexlurcher which is a lovely dog, i had heard that about ESS but they are really nice. so arethe patterdales a mission to train or only a little headstrong,

 

and do you have any advice on the other questions? thanks rob

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A cocker or ESS would be the best dog for the job, without any doubt. The but, and it's a big BUT is that it's your first dog, I would go for a Lab as a first dog, easy to train, sociable and reliable (but boring).

A Spaniel is more like a cat, you learn to live with it rather than the other way around, they have a sense of humour (really!) and are very loyal and once trained they never forget, they are in my opinion, the most intelligent dogs available.

You have to treat them as a friend rather than a possession, their only wish is to please you, and they occasionally sulk if they think that they did not deserve being shouted at, but the rewards when they are trained are incredible.

I have a Cocker, she has retrieved numerous geese and hares with no problem, she is now 12 1/2 and getting unsteady on her pins, but when the time comes there will be another Cocker in her place.

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A cocker or ESS would be the best dog for the job, without any doubt. The but, and it's a big BUT is that it's your first dog, I would go for a Lab as a first dog, easy to train, sociable and reliable (but boring).

A Spaniel is more like a cat, you learn to live with it rather than the other way around, they have a sense of humour (really!) and are very loyal and once trained they never forget, they are in my opinion, the most intelligent dogs available.

You have to treat them as a friend rather than a possession, their only wish is to please you, and they occasionally sulk if they think that they did not deserve being shouted at, but the rewards when they are trained are incredible.

I have a Cocker, she has retrieved numerous geese and hares with no problem, she is now 12 1/2 and getting unsteady on her pins, but when the time comes there will be another Cocker in her place.

 

i have thought about this but my mum doesnt like labs and im 17 so currently she is boss being as she didnt want a dog anyway i have to go along with her

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Wat could be the decideing factor in your choice is the ground you are going to be hunting on occupied by badgers and their setts.If it is a gundog breed might be alot less hassell.atvb dell

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Be careful with small terrier types for ferreting as they can take to going in after the rabbits, have a 10"jrt that has been taken off ferreting until I know if she will work other stuff. Spaniel types have a good nose and can be good dogs, but they are mad, my current ferreting partner is 1st cross terrier spaniel and is 4 now, only now has she calmed down enough to work with the ferrets. Always in the past far to excitable around nets and buries. For flushing though both types are ideal, as long as you are careful with terriers entering holes. For a ferreting partner a small lurcher or longer legged terrier would be good.

 

On a different note I have started taking my wife's collie out and she is proving an excellent dog for flushing and marking, and she isn't that slow either.

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Be careful with small terrier types for ferreting as they can take to going in after the rabbits, have a 10"jrt that has been taken off ferreting until I know if she will work other stuff. Spaniel types have a good nose and can be good dogs, but they are mad, my current ferreting partner is 1st cross terrier spaniel and is 4 now, only now has she calmed down enough to work with the ferrets. Always in the past far to excitable around nets and buries. For flushing though both types are ideal, as long as you are careful with terriers entering holes. For a ferreting partner a small lurcher or longer legged terrier would be good.

 

On a different note I have started taking my wife's collie out and she is proving an excellent dog for flushing and marking, and she isn't that slow either.

 

so a long legged one like a plummer? there are badger and fox holes but would a terrier be a problem with these?

 

collies are reaaly nice dogs and they are easyto train as far as i know, and my mum likes them a bit :clapper: would they be good for flushing and retrieving rabbits and pigeons? less mad than a spaniel or worse?

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to use a spanial to flush game and be steady so you can shoot the game and have the dog retrieve to hand is one discipline most dogs will mark rabbit sets but if by standing gaurd you expect the dog to pin down any netted bunny or to catch the bunny if it escapes then i think you will have your work cut out for you asking any dog to be steady one minute and then wanting it to run in the next . get two dogs :D atb.

Edited by hily

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to use a spanial to flush game and be steady so you can shoot the game and have the dog retrieve to hand is one discipline most dogs will mark rabbit sets but if by standing gaurd you expect the dog to pin down any netted bunny or to catch the bunny if it escapes then i think you will have your work cut out for you asking any dog to be steady one minute and then wanting it to run in the next . get two dogs :D atb.

 

ok my nets do the work so i will just use it for marking the other properties i am looking for mainly. i likethe sound of a collie if its a feasable option with the gun and retrieving and flushing.

 

does anyone know this?

 

cheers

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Collies are definately worth using, will be trainable for anything you want. Look into articles etc in magazines and you will come across stories of collies on the beating line. Pluto retrieves dummies back to hand no trouble and she has a good nose for finding game. Lacks a gear or maybe two to run down open ground bunnies. Look about and it shouldn't be hard to get a good working collie, or even a first cross collie whippet? Give you the option to lamp too and still be versatile for everything else. A good collie, racy type will easy be good for catching the odd bolters too.

 

Don't know much about the plummers but i like the look of them and they aren't known as an earth dog so if you look into the parents then it could be a good job. Some of the leggier russells are worth a look too or lakies.

 

Try and get from working lines, although any dog should be able to mark rabbits, get from good blood and train well. If you and your mum like the collies, I would consider a collie/whippet with a collie colour. :)

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I think something like a Plummer would suit you down to the ground, Bred for bushing and will rarely go to ground, an easy going, biddable, smallish dog. would work well for Ferreting and can be great bushing dogs. Fairly trainable but not too hyped up. Plus their quite good looking Terriers so your mother would like it too! JMO

 

I'd steer clear of a Patterdale, unless you've got a collar and spade handy! Bred for earth work, they just can't help themselves!

 

Dry food will be fine, the BARF diet is great for a dog but not so great for your mum!

 

As for the Insurance, most will not insure a working dog, and the ones that do will cost a lot.

Insure as a pet then If the dog gets injured then you were 'just out of a walk!' :whistling:

 

All the best in your decision

 

Luke.

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the promblem seems to be finding a plummer round here (hasnt everyone said that at some point) they dont seem to be too common and they sound on the pricey side from other posts i have seen.

 

collies round here from worknig blood are fairly cheap and as i will be paying for everything thats probably good

 

thanks for the advice on the breed guys, i am going to look round some rspca type places to look at example of breed to see size and looks etc as i know a lot of them will be crap behaviour wise and not any good for working, i am looking for a pup as we just found an abandoned 6 week old kitten they need to learn from a youngage to accept each other.

 

now what about the run and bedding as it will be an outside arrangement(no dogs in the house, my mums a clean freak, its really sad)

 

what size should this be and does anyone have any examples?

 

thanks guys

 

atb rob

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my biggest concern would be that you are 17 and live with your mum and shes not keen on having a dog!!! Are you at school or college or at work? If so who will look after the dog?? its not easy even when you love them, and you cant expect your mum to do it if shes not into the whole dog thing. Might be woth waiting a while until you are ina better situation maybe?

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my biggest concern would be that you are 17 and live with your mum and shes not keen on having a dog!!! Are you at school or college or at work? If so who will look after the dog?? its not easy even when you love them, and you cant expect your mum to do it if shes not into the whole dog thing. Might be woth waiting a while until you are ina better situation maybe?

 

she is coming round to the idea, i am at college and working part time. i will be the one looking after the dog and funding it i am capable and we are in the perfect situation with lots of land an most of my free time is taken up doing things where the dog would be useful and used.

 

thanks for your concern but its fine, i have a space to put the kenel/run but just want to know of idea on how to make it, and sizes etc

 

atb rob

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