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No more stalking


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#1 wireviz

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Posted 18 June 2009 - 02:48 pm

This message is to confirm that the Scottish Government has today published a consultation document to help inform the development of a prospective Wildlife and Natural Environment Bill.

You can access the consultation document at: http://www.scotland....221/0082607.pdf

We have also created a web presence which provides background information about the consultation. These pages be accessed at: http://www.scotland..../WildNatEnvBill

The deadline for responses to the consultation is Friday 4 September 2009. Once the views expressed in consultation have been assessed, the Scottish Government’s current intention is to introduce a Wildlife and Natural Environment Bill to the Parliament at a suitable opportunity.


Folks

I think that your responses are needed to this!

Rgds Ian


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#2 mubz2cool

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Posted 18 June 2009 - 04:35 pm

This message is to confirm that the Scottish Government has today published a consultation document to help inform the development of a prospective Wildlife and Natural Environment Bill.

You can access the consultation document at: http://www.scotland....221/0082607.pdf

We have also created a web presence which provides background information about the consultation. These pages be accessed at: http://www.scotland..../WildNatEnvBill

The deadline for responses to the consultation is Friday 4 September 2009. Once the views expressed in consultation have been assessed, the Scottish Government’s current intention is to introduce a Wildlife and Natural Environment Bill to the Parliament at a suitable opportunity.


Folks

I think that your responses are needed to this!

Rgds Ian

how will this effect stalking in scotland? i dont realy understand ..

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#3 mudman

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Posted 19 June 2009 - 12:42 am

How will it effect you.

From what I understand the DCS want to have overall control of all deer stalking in Scotland. They will do this by only allowing those stalkers who are on an approved list shoot deer, i.e illegal to shoot deer if not on this list. To be on this approved list you will have to possess some form of, as yet undefined, qualification.

So no more stalking in Scotland for you unless you are prepared to jump through a few more hoops and I dare say spend more money on this, as yet undefined, qualification to be on the 'list'.

#4 macberran

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Posted 19 June 2009 - 06:16 am

This is being discussed on another forum, we need too act fast. Don't want to sound dull but what do we do.

#5 FOXHUNTER

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Posted 19 June 2009 - 10:53 am

I have spoken to BASC Scotland today who are fully opposed to this Bill. They are compiling a response which should be out shortly but we must all make a stand against this as the implications are far greater than deer stalking in Scotland as there may well be a ripple effect in England . Not only that as it is an Animal Welfare Bill it could eventually lead to some sort of qualification for lamping foxes etc................

There are currently 1700 stalkers with DMQ LEVEL 2 awarded and another 1700 part completed at the minute.

If you value your stalking I would seriously think about gaining the necessary qualifications as if not you could be seriously pissed off in the future.

#6 mubz2cool

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Posted 19 June 2009 - 02:05 pm

thats ridiculous, it souds like its just another mony making scheme! i mean fair enough it is good to controle who can shoot a deer but surely dmq1&2 should be enough! we all need to get together on this one and make a stand! whats the next step then? what can we do to stop this?

#7 shottyscotty

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Posted 19 June 2009 - 10:54 pm

i was at the dcs meeting when they discussed it and so was about 150 other stalkers and its not going to happen soon but the dcs are recomending that all stalkers should have to do dcs 1 and 2 or they wont be allowed to shoot deer

#8 wireviz

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Posted 20 June 2009 - 08:52 am

i was at the dcs meeting when they discussed it and so was about 150 other stalkers and its not going to happen soon but the dcs are recomending that all stalkers should have to do dcs 1 and 2 or they wont be allowed to shoot deer


Sorry scotty your wrong mate if it was a simple as that then no one would be that botherd they are in this law takeing full control even of government lands parks recreation areas etc.
It will mean you need to sit a new test one set by the DCS dmq will not be the entry level. QUOTE FROM JAMIE HAMMOND. (While there are some good areas coverd by the dmq 2 it is by by=no means the answer to compitent stalking and has alot of failings that we will address.
Asked what the new test will be Answer quote (we will only decided this once we have full control ).
Asked what about the REGISTER an how it would effect the ones not wanting to do level to or your new exam .Answer they will not be aloud to stalk deer and thats the type of persons we dont want stalking deer.
Asked if there would be a cost ever in the future for staying on the register no answer and i was told that he had given me to much info already.'

scary indeed ps this man has not done his lev 2 but will get a by in to anything that is law.

PS REMEMBER THESE ARE NOT PROPOSALS THIS WILL BE LAW AND IF YOU BRAKE IT YOU WILL LOOSE EVERY THING YOU HAVE WORKED SO HARD TO KEEP.

DCS Jamie Hammond's Mob number 07795127706 please phone him to clarify what i have written and make sure you get an answer to at least one question and lets us know what it is.

Edited by wireviz, 20 June 2009 - 11:32 am.


#9 mubz2cool

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Posted 20 June 2009 - 09:33 am

so they are going to force us to take a test set by them and then prob charge us the earth to take it and also have an anual fee to be on this regester! what is the next step we need to act fast.. do you all think a meeting will do any good if we invite basc and similar bodies. I think Jamie Hmmond should be invited and should answer all our questions... anyother sugestions????

Edited by mubz2cool, 20 June 2009 - 09:34 am.


#10 Night Hunter

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Posted 20 June 2009 - 07:37 pm

DCS are a bunch of sneaky money grabbing cu*ts it said on thier website that they would not be doing this everyone should write a letter to the scottish parliment opposing this crazy and unworkable reform,remember that if they get it through there will be no more forign stalkers bringing revenue to our estates as they will have to jump through the same hoops as us or they will be breaking the law also no more english stalkers who come up to gods country stalking unless they have this costly qualification,i posted a poll a while back on this very subject and it was pinned on the deer stalking and management board it did not get very many votes but it shows the feeling of the people that took the time to vote if it gets more votes we could print it off and send it in to the scottish parliment,it would be interesting to know if BASC or any of the other associations that we are subscribed to are in favour of this reform that will price the working man out of stalking and what they propose to do to stop the reform :icon_redface:


SEND AN EMAIL TO: steven.macgregor@scotland.gsi.gov.uk TO OPPOSE THE DEER SECTION OF THE BILL ASAP TO SAVE OUR STALKING FROM THE DCS



DCS HOPE YOU ARE PROUD OF YOURSELVES NEVER MET A MORE SNEAKY ORGANISATION

THIS IS A STAB IN THE BACK FOR MANY OF SCOTLANDS STALKERS

Edited by Night Hunter, 20 June 2009 - 07:53 pm.


#11 Night Hunter

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Posted 21 June 2009 - 10:48 am

Just emailed mine but he is out of office till 7 july so i forwarded it to his personal mail box as requested by his auto reply :D

Dear Mr Mcgregor,
I write to inform you that I strongly oppose the deer section of the new bill because I have been stalking deer for about nine years and have had the luck to have a friend and mentor who has shot deer for over thirty years,both of us have never had any safety issues,I have already spent a considerable amount of money on deer stalking,I work as a gas service engineer for the local council I also work a second part time job to support my family,I recently had to spend allot of money to gain another certificate to continue in my part time job,so there is only so much money I can spend on my chosen hobby,I only shoot and prepare what I put in the freezer for me and my family and not for comercial gain sometimes only going out into the field to observe the deer and returnig home without shooting any and I think that the new proposals made by DCS will simply price myself and thousands of others out of what is seen as a working mans sport these proposals do nothing for the welfare of the deer because it will force people to shoot more deer than they would normally and make poor choices of what deer should actually be shot because they will simply be shooting deer to fund these new qualifications as the money would have to come from somewhere ,If it were solely about deer welfare and safety and not about comercial gain then the DCS should be holding free seminars all around scotland which I am sure stalkers would attend volintarily, I have personally witnessed people who have the DCS1+2 certificates shooting deer and they definately do not care about deer welfare amongst what i have seen are poorly placed shots ,dangerous shots without suitable backstops,indescriminate deer selection,gralloching in poor light without inpecting the carcase or the pluck and then passing it into the food chain and the list goes on .

I am writing to you in the hope that you will help myself and others who will be affected by this bill,The concequences for me is that I would have to retire from my much loved hobby as it would be comercialised by dcs proposals,the concequences for scotland however would run much deeper with the loss of revenue for the estates who I see as the keepers of the countryside because all of the foreign stalkers who travel to scotland every year spending money on accomodation etc would also have to have the DCS qualification or they would be in breach of the law,people from england who come to scotland and pay for stalking would also be affected by the new proposals as they too would require this costly certificate,hence the only people who stand to gain is the DCS,scotland would suffer from the loss of visiting stalkers and the revenue this generates year after year.

You may also be aware that there has been a sharp rise in the number of people applying for firearms certificates in order to take up deer stalking ,this generates cash through renewal fees etc for the police forces some of which will be lost due to people simply being priced out of shooting.Everything to do with shooting has a price tag and these prices have constantly increased creating revenue for local buisnesses.

There has been a rise in deer numbers which in turn have been causing damage to woodland through brashing and grazeing of young trees ,causing damage to farmers crops due to grazeing,and causing seious road traffic accidents on Britains roads and the DCS answer this with pricing people out of deer stalking ,reducing the number of people controlling deer will increase the problem.

I have been told that the British Association for Shooting and Concervation and the Scottish Gamekeepers Association are also against the proposals made by DCS.

I thank you for taking the time to read this letter and look forward to recieving your reply.



Best Regards


Thomas Smith

#12 Malt

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Posted 21 June 2009 - 11:07 am

Why do these fuckers feel the need to keep piling on the red tape? The gun laws/hunting laws are already some of the tightest in the world. The countryside knows how to look after itself, it's been OK for hundreds of years without the masses of red tape & legislation. Sometimes I feel these schemes are dreamed up in offices by people trying to look busy.

Another cynical way of looking at it, is that these schemes are spat out on the advice of people who stand to make money out of it, a bit like the way that the large manufacturers of building products do when it comes to building regs. They come up with a new product or idea, then all of a sudden that product/idea is essential, and becomes law. It stinks. :thumbdown:

#13 SNAP SHOT

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Posted 21 June 2009 - 11:20 am

One answer mate........



MONEY


plain and simple, i've seen some members of deer society's Who preached ALL they knew and couldn't hit a barn door, and most of what they talked was crap,

If you are taught all the things you need to stalk sucessfully, then you will never stray far wrong, be it shot placement, carcas prep, disease inspection and what to look for, skining, and most importantly firearms safety and marksmanship....

If you have these skills then you don't need a bit of paper to tell you you can do them sucessfully..... ;)

#14 mubz2cool

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Posted 21 June 2009 - 01:22 pm

One answer mate........



MONEY


plain and simple, i've seen some members of deer society's Who preached ALL they knew and couldn't hit a barn door, and most of what they talked was crap,

If you are taught all the things you need to stalk sucessfully, then you will never stray far wrong, be it shot placement, carcas prep, disease inspection and what to look for, skining, and most importantly firearms safety and marksmanship....

If you have these skills then you don't need a bit of paper to tell you you can do them sucessfully..... http://www.thehuntinglife.com/forums/pub...


well said snap shot! :clapper:

#15 wireviz

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Posted 23 June 2009 - 08:37 am

I spoke to my MSP today and asked him about the revelations with regards the new legislation for deer stalkers.He didn't have a clue and did say that they rely mainly on advisers in this case the DCS. I said that i was worried that we (SCOTLAND )Would loose a lot of credibility with regards the foreign visitors. Not to mention a major amount of the 130 million pounds that field sports put into the failing economy.Any way if we don't contact our MSP /MP THEY WILL NOT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THIS SO PLEASE GET IN TOUCH GET A MEETING AND ASK HIM TO ASK THE RELIVANT QUESTION THAT WE NEED ANSWERD.

If we don't act then it is a fact that the MSP,S and English MP,S Will not know what we are moaning about please go to your surgery and make sure on the 4th of September the questions and worries are put across by your MSP


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DEERSTALKING IS A SCIENCE


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